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General artillery, SPGs, MLRS and long range ATGMs thread.

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2 hours ago, Stimpy75 said:


Cool pod, very poor implementation. 

These rockets, even when guided, are only suitable for direct fire or close range fire. Bringing a truck to the frontline, where ATGMs, ATRs, and medium cannons are abundant, is a big NO.

Also where is the control station? Or the armor kit to protect the cabin from the heat and toxic smoke? 


Far too many manufacturers decide to only showcase their weapons, on platforms that are often absolutely ridiculous for that purpose. 

Why is it so hard to understand that a customer ALWAYS prefers seeing a proper application, a valid spot for the presented system, and not the standalone system with no context.

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56 minutes ago, Lord_James said:

This is made by the UAE/Saudi right? So I guess they wouldn’t mind the non-precision rockets landing on civilians... or the crew getting roasted by a Kornet. 

Made FOR the UAE, but not by them. It's made as a joint venture by Jobaria and Roketsan, with Roketsan quite obviously being the chief developer and integrator here, and Jobaria doing the manufacturing. 

They also made the following system just a couple years ago:


Both firing essentially just Grad copies.

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1 hour ago, Lord_James said:

This is made for the UAE/Saudi right? So I guess they wouldn’t mind the non-precision rockets landing on civilians... or the crew getting roasted by a Kornet. 



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3 hours ago, Stimpy75 said:

it´s the 107mm MTBRL from Roketsan,(copy of the chinese system)

i believe sth like 11 km range

here is the link to the products



Only way this could be effective is with a much lighter vehicle, like a JLTV instead of FMTV, and actual guidance for the rockets. 

It seems not even Roketsan makes guidance kits for 107mm. Without guidance, you're basically putting a lot of a light formation's resources and capacity towards a weapon designed for saturation, but without the actual means of a meaningful saturation. 


It really loses out to 120mm mortars. 


More than that, it is actually far less attractive than contemporary systems that offer a lighter package, with more powerful rockets, at least double the range, and with guidance to make every shot count.

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Apparently, the M109A8 won't have an autoloader before 2024.




HUNTSVILLE, Ala. — The U.S. Army is developing an extended-range cannon artillery system and will start building prototypes by the end of the year, according to the head of the services Long-Range Precision Fires modernization program. But beyond the first iteration, the service plans to add an autoloader starting in 2024, Col. John Rafferty explained.

The Army plans to build 8 prototypes of the ERCA artillery system by 2023 with a culminating technology demonstration, Rafferty said. The service is focused on improvements to the platform, the projectile, the ammunition and propellant.

After years of planning, the Paladin Integrated Management program aims to upgrade the Paladin howitzer with an M109A7 chassis. From there, the ERCA program will upgrade PIM’s turret with a 58-caliber, 30-foot long gun tube capable of shooting farther than 70 kilometers.


“That is a major improvement,” Rafferty said, but “we still have a ways to go with integrating the precision guidance kit with a GPS fuze for that.”
The challenge is the muzzle blasts are so much higher, he said, so it changes the way the fuze operates.

Rafferty said the Army has shot an Excalibur round from the gun tube and hit a target at 62 kilometers.
The first battalion will be fielded in fiscal 2023. The next increment beginning in 2024 will involve equipping the cannon with the autoloader.

“The autoloader is key to generating the volume of fire that really gives us that lethality at range,” Rafferty said, but it’s “a pretty complicated technology to develop.”
Currently, the Army relies on two cannoneers to equip a dumb projectile with smart fuzes. This is being done in Iraq, Syria and Afghanistan, Rafferty noted.
And “there is a complex fuze-setting process and battery life on the fuzes, which means you can’t fuze them hours beforehand,” he explained. “You need to screw the fuzes on, then set them, and the charge lasts for a certain length of time.”
But this process is challenging for autoloaders, he noted, which means the Army will have to take a unique approach.


While there is an internal effort to build an autoloader prototype, the service is also looking to the Army Applications Lab at Army Futures Command in Austin, Texas, for ideas that might approach the challenge differently, Rafferty said.
The lab is located in an innovator’s hub called the Capital Factory and is geared toward uniting Army requirements writers and developers with individuals and companies with nontraditional technology that could be applied to efforts underway within the service.


I'm a bit confused about the first paragraph, since there are already a couple A8s rolling around...unless they are officially not type-classified as M109E8s but as mere version-agnostic testbeds.

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5 minutes ago, Renegade334 said:


Apparently, the M109A8 testbeds we've seen so far won't have an autoloader before 2024.




I'm a bit confused about the first paragraph, since there are already a couple A8s rolling around...unless they are officially not type-classified as M109E8s but as mere testbeds.


Those are A6 being used to test the gun.


The semi-autoloader in the A7 still needs someone to put a round in the tray and load the charge.

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   Yury Tomashov died - the creator of the "Msta-S" and "Akatsiya" SPGs.

   Member of the Russian Academy of Rocket and Artillery Sciences Yury Tomashov died. This sad news was officially confirmed at Uralvagonzavod. Former General Designer of Transmash Central Design Bureau was 89 years old


   Yuri Tomashov participated in the development of several dozen samples of military equipment. More than 20 of them were adopted. Among them are the Akatsiya 152-mm self-propelled howitzer, the Tulip 240-mm self-propelled mortar, the Hyacinth-S self-propelled 152 mm self-propelled gun and the Msta-S 152 mm self-propelled howitzer. He was rightly considered the founder of modern self-propelled artillery.

   For services to the development of new types of military equipment, Tomashov was awarded two Orders of Lenin, the Order of the Red Banner of Labor, the Order for Services to the Fatherland, 4th degree (1999) and the Sickle and Hammer gold medal with the title Hero of Socialist Labor. In addition, he was the winner of the State Prize of the USSR (1974) and the Lenin Prize (1982), he had more than 60 copyright certificates for inventions.

   He took part in the development and development in the production of self-propelled artillery systems SU-100P, SU-100PM, SU-152G, SU-1. As the 1st Deputy Chief Designer of OKB-3, he took part in the leadership of creating self-propelled artillery systems SG Akatsiya (2S3, 2S3M), Tulpan (2S4), Hyacinthe/Giatsint (2S5), for which the team of co-authors was awarded the State Prize of the USSR and the Lenin Prize, the Krug AA system (2K11), a tracked minelayer, ZSU-37-2 Enisei, a Kupol self-propelled radar station 1RL135 and a Szhatie laser tank.

   Under the direction of Y. V. Tomashov, the Msta-S SPG (2S19) was created.


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   On March 28, 1963, the Soviet Army adopted the BM-21 Grad MRLS.


   The first combat use of the BM-21 took place 50 years ago - March 15, 1969, during the armed conflict on Damanski Island. For all the time about 8.5 thousand systems of this type were build. "Grads" are in service with several dozen countries and are not going to retire.













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   Test with minimal power of YET (Directed Energy Systems and Technologies) railgun. 


The newest version of their electromagnetic rail gun systems: ŞAHİ209 - Block II has a range of 50 kilometers with a pulsed power source of 10 megajoules.
















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56 minutes ago, Karamazov said:

"Syrian experience"

Why does NATO Middle Eastern wars experience look like this:

  Hide contents


But Russian ME wars experience looks like this:



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15 minutes ago, Serge said:


Maybe. But I think this is a stupid resource management. Mrap they buy. Armored cars too. There are models like GAZ Tiger. But year after year we see this ridiculous cars.
I am sure this is all the influence of mobile strike groups by ISIS. 

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