Jump to content
Sturgeon's House
Walter_Sobchak

North Korea, you so crazy!

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Donward said:

Wuh... wuh...wuh...wait guys! We can still have a deal. Please Mister Trump! We can still do a deal!

 

http://thehill.com/policy/international/389305-north-korea-signals-it-is-still-open-to-talks-after-trump-cancels-summit

 

 

'I hope we can still be friends' is probably the more accurate analogy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Donward said:

Wuh... wuh...wuh...wait guys! We can still have a deal. Please Mister Trump! We can still do a deal!

 

http://thehill.com/policy/international/389305-north-korea-signals-it-is-still-open-to-talks-after-trump-cancels-summit

 

 

Or maybe it's just Kim trying to fuck with Trump?  Lets face it, North Korea scuttled these talks.  Trump's letter was an attempt to make it look like he was the one that decided the issue, not North Korea.  It may very well be that Trump is trying to put on an act, that of the crazy out of the control guy that might do anything.  The problem with that is that it's not just North Korea that sees this, its South Korea, China, and Japan.  These countries need to be on board as well if any meaningful negotiations are to take place.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Donward reminds me our Putin fans who belive that everything Putin does is part of a Big Cunning Plan, that he plays multidimensional chess or something.

C86AkkOWAAA50Ic.jpg

 

11 hours ago, Collimatrix said:

I agree with Donward's take.  This is Trump playing head games, which is something he is good at.

/.../

Trump is trying to project the image that he's a crazy mofo who might just attack North Korea.

   i don't think that all this was planned. Maybe Trump have dog nose, but from my couch this all looks as a failure. NK survived way more than Trump twitter dick measurement contest and managed to get nuclear weapons and delivery system in attempt to secure itself. They can wait for sometime, IMO.

 

16 hours ago, Walter_Sobchak said:

Dd-NbH2V0AA7mQd.jpg

It is a little thing, but if it was all planned, why would people bother with organising summit that would not have been happened anyway? :D 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, LoooSeR said:

   i don't think that all this was planned. Maybe Trump have dog nose, but from my couch this all looks as a failure. NK survived way more than Trump twitter dick measurement contest and managed to get nuclear weapons and delivery system in attempt to secure itself. They can wait for sometime, IMO.

 

 

I don't think it was "part of the plan" in the sense that Trump has a detailed vision of everything that will transpire in the next several months.  This was improvisation, but Trump likes to improvise a lot.  In fact, he seems most comfortable when he is just making it up as he goes along.  His speeches read from a teleprompter were forgettable.  His speeches when he is just saying crazy shit as it occurs to him are where all of his "wise" quotes come from.  Like this:

 



God help us, in ten years this will be taught in high schools as an example of incisive political rhetoric.  In a way, it is.  Look at how the crowd is going wild, even though the things Trump is saying are completely idiotic.  I cannot emphasize this enough; this is a really stupid speech.  But this is the difference between Trump and normal politicians; Trump has a lot of experience as an actor, and he can judge a crowd.  He will figure out how to get into the heads of the crowd and excite them.  He understands that the psychology of the crowd is not logical.  It is based on feelings.  He is saying words that are happy words, words that have positive connotations and associations in these people's minds, like "military," "veterans," "economy" and of course "winning."  It does not matter that the way he has glued these words together sounds like it was written by a five year old.  It is all based on Trump's (largely intuitive) understanding of human psychology, and this is a very active/reactive process.  He is strongest when he can make up the words, the body language, et cetera as he goes along.  He can gauge where the crowd is, adjust, and subtly push them to a state of excitement and even euphoria.  I bet most of those people left the speech feeling very energized, and told their friends and family about how great a speaker Trump is.  But they did not get into detailed discussions of what Trump's policy positions are, which is just as well because everything he had to say about policy positions was completely stupid.

If you're thinking this sounds like a bizarre, postmodern deconstruction of Hitler, you're close.  US political speaking takes a lot from the tradition of religious revival preaching from the 1820s-1840s.  Travelling preachers would speak to crowds in a big tent in a sort of circus-like atmosphere.  That is where the image of a Protestant preacher ranting about hellfire and brimstone comes from, and for a long time being good at this sort of speaking (really not formal speaking, more like a weird form of acting to excite the crowd) was a necessary skill for successful politicians.  But many decades have passed, and most US politicians have become empty suits who lack this skill.  Trump has it because of his experience as an actor.  Trump actually has a detailed set of policy positions and theories, but he understands that a big crowd like this is not the time to reiterate Ross Perot's theories on the negative-sum nature of NAFTA.  A big crowd is a chance to slowly build up the collective energy of the people and excite them by saying words like "proud!" and "ECONOMY!" and "MILITARY!" and "annex the Sudetenland!" "WINNING!!!"  It is not logical at all, and if you read a transcript of the speeches you would think the man is senile because the words are just meaningless babble.  It only makes sense if you see the video, and you can see how he can excite the crowd, and draw them to his side with his charming words of nonsense.

 

The same logic applies to Trump's international negotiations.  Trump does not see negotiations and deal-making as a logical process that is the outcome of two parties realizing they have common goals and interests and writing an agreement that guarantees maximum benefit for both parties.  Trump also does not see the existing United States diplomatic apparatus as being very useful.  He has not even tried to conceal his contempt for them; he thinks they are idiots who hide their incompetence behind big words and that he could do better.  Scary thing is, he is likely right.  I mean, look at this shit:

 

MZpVktQ.png

US politicians were praising Ghaddafi right before they murdered him.  The US State Department is chaotic evil.  Anyone who rejects them will be called a dictator and bombed and undermined.  Anyone who tries to play nice with them will be betrayed and impaled up the anus with a knife.  It is my sincere hope that Trump will be able to change the direction of the State Department.  If he works hard, he may be able to convert them to lawful evil.

So Trump is going to do international negotiations in a similar fashion to how he works a crowd.  Much of what he will say will seem blatantly inconsistent or illogical, and it will be, and it will seem like he is just making it up as he goes along, which he is.  But that is how he did business negotiations, and he sees international diplomacy as business negotiations but between countries.

He is using a similar approach with Kim Jong Un as he was using with the crowd.  He is making up his actions as he goes along in order to get Kim Jong Un to be in a particular psychological state; one where Kim Jong Un wants to make a deal with the United States.  So he is using psychological head games.  Trump was not attached at all to the June 12 negotiation date.  There are plenty of months to go before the US mid-term elections, after all.  If the date slips, it is no downside to Trump.  As long as the negotiations still take place, he looks good for the elections.  Even if the talks don't lead to anything, it looks good.  North Korea has been a persistent annoyance to the US political class for years, even though the existence of North Korea doesn't really affect day to day life in the USA at all.  If Trump does anything at all with North Korea, he will be able to say that he has made more "progress" on the "North Korea problem" than any other politician.  Indeed, if there are delays and the talks start right in November, that would be ideal, because the idea that Trump is "dealing with North Korea" will be fresh in the voter's minds.

It would look bad if the talks don't happen at all; Trump will be seen as having failed.  He would need to come up with a distraction (not too difficult for Trump, he will just tweet the magic word "covfefe" and the media will forget all about North Korea).  But what would be much worse is if Kim Jong Un makes an agreement with Trump... and then backs out.  Then the Democrats will say that Kim Jong Un tricked Trump, and that Trump just isn't smart enough to be president.  It is much better for Trump to appear to have failed at this negotiation than for it to appear that Trump was fooled.  But the best outcome of all is for Trump to actually be able to work out a deal where Kim Jong Un appears to peacefully step down.  Then many Americans will have mind-blowing orgasms just from reading the news because Americans think that if any country is freed from an evil dictator, then that country will become just like the USA overnight.  Realistically, if North Korea gets rid of its nuclear armament then it will probably become a buffer state with Chinese patronage, but most Americans will not figure this out in time, and they will go to the polls happily thinking of all the North Koreans who will become so much happier once their country becomes a clone of the USA.

But for that to work Trump needs to get Kim Jong Un to think in terms of artificial scarcity.  This is an old Capitalist advertiser's psychological trick.  Trump sets up a date for negotiations (that actually he did not give a fuck about), and congratulates Kim Jong Un on taking steps forwards towards peace.  Then, supposedly Kim Jong Un says some mean things about the United States.  It does not matter what it is that offended Trump, it could be nothing.  Trump then says the negotiations need to be postponed until Kim Jong Un behaves.  Then maybe Trump does some little things to provoke Kim; maybe some military exercises or he has some aircraft overfly North Korea or he does a readiness exercise of US nuclear weapons... something to remind Kim Jong Un that Trump is strong and could have his country wiped out on a whim, and maybe to plant the idea that Trump is a little crazy and might attack just because his feelings are hurt.

Trump hopes that Kim Jong Un will panic and go back to negotiations, and them Trump will say that he will be happy to resume negotiations, but Kim Jong Un needs to understand that because of his previous misbehavior, Trump cannot offer him as favorable a deal as he was ready to offer before.  If this trick works, Kim Jong Un will be only too happy to comply because he is worried that if he provokes Trump again this cycle will repeat and he will either have to fight, or he will end up with an even worse deal the next time.

 

This is exactly the same psychological trick as infomercials use when they say that the sham-wow is normally $29.99, but if you call in the next five minutes it will be only $19.99!  The idea is to plant in the buyer's mind the idea that they commit now (before they have logically thought the whole thing through and realized that they do not need a sham-wow at all), they are getting a better deal!  It's artificial scarcity.  North Korea and the USA could, in truth, hammer out a negotiation at any time.  But Trump needs to get Kim Jong Un to think that the possibility may be slipping away and he needs to commit now now now!

This all sounds a little silly and made-up, and anything about psychology always sounds a little silly and made-up, but I think it can be proven.  Henry Kissinger would advise Nixon to use similar Capitalist mind tricks.  Because Henry Kissinger was from Germany, he had a compulsion to document these mind tricks in extreme detail and in triplicate.  That is just how Germans are.  If Trump ever needs to do negotiations with Angela Merkel he will probably bring a briefcase full of documentation and he will slowly re-arrange the pages so that they are out of order and she will agree to whatever he wants as long as he stops doing that.  So insight into Capitalist mind tricks isn't just speculation, we actually have quite a bit of insight into how they are supposed to work because Henry Kissinger wrote them down.  Trump is doing recognizably similar Capitalist mind tricks.

It is also worth noting that Trump spent a fair amount of time hanging out with Richard Nixon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, LoooSeR said:

Donward reminds me our Putin fans who belive that everything Putin does is part of a Big Cunning Plan, that he plays multidimensional chess or something.

C86AkkOWAAA50Ic.jpg

 

   i don't think that all this was planned. Maybe Trump have dog nose, but from my couch this all looks as a failure. NK survived way more than Trump twitter dick measurement contest and managed to get nuclear weapons and delivery system in attempt to secure itself. They can wait for sometime, IMO.

 

It is a little thing, but if it was all planned, why would people bother with organising summit that would not have been happened anyway? :D 

 

Yup. Great leader is never wrong, it's all part of some crazy plan (which will work in the end) yada yada.

 

I think Trump cound publicly set his own balls on fire and launch the entire US arsenal at the moon trying to stamp them out on his desk, and the response would be to marvel at his impromptu non-proliferation policy and wonder if it factors into some sort of long-term plan to strong-arm the Russians.

 

It helps people in this mindset that the US is so big and potent that it can do almost anything and materially change the diplomatic situation on the ground in the process. The ship of state creates its own wind.

 

So US leaders can get away with frankly idiotic kak and still come out on top (see, for instance, the Cuban missile crisis).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, LoooSeR said:

 

   i don't think that all this was planned. Maybe Trump have dog nose

 

 

I... I like this sentence. It strikes me as very foreign and exotic. Therefore I am quoting it for posterity. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hopefully china agrees with trumps tactics, otherwise NK would end up doing pretty well from the situation. They finally get something they can call a deterrent, and they're back to the old sanctions regime to boot!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Donward said:

 

...

 

...

 

 

 

LOL Don, if you sent that horrid flashy gif to that Kurt Eichwald guy, you know the tentacle porn lefty Journalist? He would claim you were trying to attack him by trigger his epilepsy!  But hey, he now has a guy he can buddy up to, that Pedo Congressional candidate!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

North Korea's top three military officials replaced.

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-northkorea-usa-military/north-koreas-top-three-military-officials-replaced-us-official-says-idUSKCN1IZ0XY

 

The U.S. official did not identify the three military officials. Yonhap identified them as defense chief Pak Yong Sik; Ri Myong Su, chief of the Korean People’s Army’s (KPA) general staff; and Kim Jong Gak, director of the KPA’s General Political Bureau.

 

...

 

Significant?

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Scolopax said:

Can't be having any coups while you're out of town.

Coup implies  that conspirators established their own chain of command, depriving any personal from power in official structure should not be a big problem

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Singapore's daily newspaper, the Straits Times (clearly a microaggression towards the LGBTQ community) has a useful photo montage page continually being updated of the Summit.

 

https://graphics.straitstimes.com/STI/STIMEDIA/Interactives/2018/06/trump-kim-summit/index.html

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

NORK Force One...

 

692244eab0.jpg

 

Was an Air China 747. So make of that what you will.

 

Scenes from Kim's arrival on the tarmac with the Singapore Foreign minister.

 

https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/3-singapore-bound-aircraft-one-believed-to-be-carrying-kim-jong-un-departed-pyongyang-on

 

An Il-76 was on hand too although reported to be carrying supplies for #BestKorea's diplomatic party.

 

691271bc86.jpg

 

And the NORK motorcade.

 

 

 

Edit:

 

Third North Korean plane lands at Changi Airport

The third North Korean plane landed at Changi Airport after 3.45pm on Sunday (June 10). The Air Koryo aircraft in state livery is reportedly carrying the sister of North Korean leader Kim Jong Un.

 

...

 

*Darth Vader Sister gif here*

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And Lil Rocketman meets with the Singapore Prime minister, Lee Hsien Loong

 

 

 

The body language of Kim is... very self conscious. That is not a world leader confident in his own skin.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And President Trump in Air Force One touched down, apparently ahead of schedule. 

 

6948e56e23.jpg

 

Whereupon the residents of Singapore immediately began pledging their allegiance to the United States in hopes of becoming the 52nd State.

 

 

 

69529b5d19.jpg

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...