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Khand-e

The Small Arms Thread, Part 8: 2018; ICSR to be replaced by US Army with interim 15mm Revolver Cannon.

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1 hour ago, Toimisto said:

Given that today 6.5mm ammo is talked about like its the second coming, why the hell did the japanese switch from a 6.5mm to a 7.7mm round, given that the 6.5 seems perfectly adequate?

And then they got hit with nukes.

Going from history, then: 

 

Straying away from 6.5 MASTERCALIBUR = Immediate nuking.

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6 hours ago, Toimisto said:

Given that today 6.5mm ammo is talked about like its the second coming, why the hell did the japanese switch from a 6.5mm to a 7.7mm round, given that the 6.5 seems perfectly adequate?

 

I think they wanted better long range performance from their machine guns. They also may have wanted more volume for observation/API projectiles.

All of these factors contributed to the 50-year period of .30 cal dominance worldwide, from 1903-1953.

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6 hours ago, Toimisto said:

Given that today 6.5mm ammo is talked about like its the second coming, why the hell did the japanese switch from a 6.5mm to a 7.7mm round, given that the 6.5 seems perfectly adequate?

 

The Japanese weren't the only ones making such a switch, and I think one could argue that it was almost a trend.   The Italians, Dutch, Sweden, Austria, and a handful of other countries had adopted 6.5mm cartridges around the turn of the century.  The Italians too were switching to a larger diameter (7.35mm) just before World War 2 (though the war interrupted those plans).

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16 hours ago, GMerlon said:

 

The Japanese weren't the only ones making such a switch, and I think one could argue that it was almost a trend.   The Italians, Dutch, Sweden, Austria, and a handful of other countries had adopted 6.5mm cartridges around the turn of the century.  The Italians too were switching to a larger diameter (7.35mm) just before World War 2 (though the war interrupted those plans).

 

Right. Also notable is that from about 1903-1953, no nation on earth successfully fielded a new caliber under 0.298" in diameter. I find this conspicuous, and refer to it as the "50 Year Period of .30 Cal Dominance". 7mm, 6.5mm, and other cals remained in use during this period, and there experimentals in that range, but nothing new that anyone committed to. On the other hand, new .30 cal rounds were successfully adopted and fielded during this period, so it's not like the field was stagnant.

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3 hours ago, Sturgeon said:

 

Right. Also notable is that from about 1903-1953, no nation on earth successfully fielded a new caliber under 0.298" in diameter. I find this conspicuous, and refer to it as the "50 Year Period of .30 Cal Dominance". 7mm, 6.5mm, and other cals remained in use during this period, and there experimentals in that range, but nothing new that anyone committed to. On the other hand, new .30 cal rounds were successfully adopted and fielded during this period, so it's not like the field was stagnant.

 

8x57mm Mauser and 7.92x33mm Kurz were designed during that time and the Germans are always right about everything.

 

CHECKMATE ATHEISTS!

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@Sturgeon any info on the development history? because the video is from 2011. Are there any changes since then?

Isnt it bad that in order to extract a cartridge that you need to feed a new one? Or am i missing asomething?

Also where is the hook on the polymer cased stuff? is it just money or people waiting in which caliber to adopt?

 

Edit: I would love to know if other manufacturers are working on their take on polymer cased

 

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6 hours ago, Willy Brandt said:

@Sturgeon any info on the development history? because the video is from 2011. Are there any changes since then?

 

AFAIK the prototypes in use right now are the same ones from that time. They've just been putting more rounds through them.
 

6 hours ago, Willy Brandt said:

Isnt it bad that in order to extract a cartridge that you need to feed a new one? Or am i missing asomething?

 

There is a rammer that can extract rounds.
 

6 hours ago, Willy Brandt said:

Also where is the hook on the polymer cased stuff? is it just money or people waiting in which caliber to adopt?

 

It's not quite done in its development, and last I heard they were getting almost nada for cash to continue the program.
 

6 hours ago, Willy Brandt said:

Edit: I would love to know if other manufacturers are working on their take on polymer cased

 

Other mfgrs are working on composite cased (metallic base with plastic body), but I don't know of any other polymer CT efforts.

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10 hours ago, Khand-e said:

 

8x57mm Mauser and 7.92x33mm Kurz were designed during that time and the Germans are always right about everything.

 

CHECKMATE ATHEISTS!

Neither of those are 7.92 bofors or 7.92 Cetme Voss so.... Really in a way we all lost...

 

I continue to hold out hope that the gerpaderps will be rightfully defeated and we will see the rise of something properly lulzy as a 7.62 nato replacement...

 

Honestly I'm totally pulling for a 7.92 voss / 5.56 fabrl / 4.6 interdynamics fumer hybrid bullet around 7.92 actual projectile diameter and 8.5mm'ish muzzle diameter slightly tapered down from the 9.5-10mm pseudosabot/obturator/CT'ish nose cap starting OD at the chamber to whip that big long bastard of a finely shaped VLD projectile down the gain twist rifled tapering bore and out of it's reflex suppressor capped under 19 inch total tube length screaming for blood and looking to wreck shit!

 

There's actually method to my madness here guys and bear in mind 7.62 NATO replacement means I'm purposely wanting versatility.

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8 minutes ago, roguetechie said:

Neither of those are 7.92 bofors or 7.92 Cetme Voss so.... Really in a way we all lost...

 

I continue to hold out hope that the gerpaderps will be rightfully defeated and we will see the rise of something properly lulzy as a 7.62 nato replacement...

 

Honestly I'm totally pulling for a 7.92 voss / 5.56 fabrl / 4.6 interdynamics fumer hybrid bullet around 7.92 actual projectile diameter and 8.5mm'ish muzzle diameter slightly tapered down from the 9.5-10mm pseudosabot/obturator/CT'ish nose cap starting OD at the chamber to whip that big long bastard of a finely shaped VLD projectile down the gain twist rifled tapering bore and out of it's reflex suppressor capped under 19 inch total tube length screaming for blood and looking to wreck shit!

 

There's actually method to my madness here guys and bear in mind 7.62 NATO replacement means I'm purposely wanting versatility.

 

That makes me think of the 8x60mm Squad Support Weapon concept I came up with ages ago. Necked down .338 Lapua, 1,000 m/s muzzle velocity (I estimated at the time, no idea if it's correct) with a 12g extremely low drag bullet:

 

8x60mm_ssw_by_nolo84-d53jqev.png

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I was having full on delusions involving more api and raufossy type badness than your super 7 in a fumer configuration.

 

A sorta inside out sj-esc russian pistol ap ammo concept mixed with an EPR ish general purpose projectile concept designed to wreck unarmored shit and epr fragment or shed much of it's outer bulk to go AP when needed and have a fumer variant if needed...

 

Basically your general fuck your couch i don't have to teach my people windage and holdovers I'm from the hammers slammers powerguns school of external ballistics.

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7 hours ago, Sturgeon said:

TYM drops some bombs:
 

 

 

 

Yep. I was going to bring this up but was out and about selling salmon today.

 

I like how Yankee calls out IraqVetHitlerHitler(AteAteAteAte) charging $4,000 to gun companies in exchange for featuring their products on his YouTube infomercial channel. It actually warms the cuckolds of this hicktown reporter's heart seeing a shill getting called out. Plus his channel sucks. How does this mush-mouthed white trash have 1.5 million subscribers? Do people really like to hear a redneck with a double-digit IQ stammer and stutter for half an hour?

 

Am watching this at the moment and it is PAINFUL the bad acting.

 

@2:53

 

 

 

Fucking LOL. These gomers playing with crayons and a seashell sums it about up.

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2 hours ago, Collimatrix said:

Russian-language article about some Tokarev SMG designs I'd never seen before:

https://pikabu.ru/story/avtomaticheskie_pistoletyi_tokareva_4424826

Good SADJ article about the history of the DShK:

http://www.sadefensejournal.com/wp/?p=1305

 

Leszekis a great guy, but hoooooly hell the beginning of that DShK article is a mess.

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The article he links to is a real piece of paid readverviewment.

 

Quote

When it comes to .223 Rem. semi-automatic rifles, Ruger’s Mini-14 has long been one of the obvious choices. And it’s no wonder, considering it offers nearly the same handiness as the M1 Carbine, the ballistics of the AR15, and the feel of the classic M1 Garand and M14.

 

If the first line of your article could easily have been plucked out of a Ruger product description, then you have failed as a reviewer.

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Quote

even if it’s unfairly judged by the same criteria as today’s predominant platform, the AR, which enjoys the huge advantages of U.S. military adoption and unlimited manufacturing sources.

 

He forgot "not being a huge pile of garbage to begin with".

 

 

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