LoooSeR Posted May 18, 2016 Report Share Posted May 18, 2016 IS-3s in Israel (captured) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter_Sobchak Posted May 18, 2016 Report Share Posted May 18, 2016 There were a ATGMS used by the Arabs in the 67 war? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Collimatrix Posted May 18, 2016 Report Share Posted May 18, 2016 I don't think so. I'd always heard anyway that AT-3 was a nasty shock in '73 to Israelis but also to US observers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsh Posted May 18, 2016 Report Share Posted May 18, 2016 Both the Israelis and Egyptians had a handful of vehicle mounted ATGMs in 1967. Cobras and S11s as far as I remember for the IDF. I do not know of any actually being fired. There was neither the doctrine nor numbers for either side to employ the missiles with any effect. Sagger was not a great surprise to the IDF in 1973. They had encountered it in small amounts during the War of Attrition between 1968 and the Yom Kippur war. What was a huge surprise was the numbers of ATGMs used in company with an apparently endless supply of RPGs. That and the greatly improved level of training and determination offered by the Arab forces. Cheers Marsh Belesarius, Collimatrix and LostCosmonaut 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Collimatrix Posted May 19, 2016 Report Share Posted May 19, 2016 Thanks Marsh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsh Posted May 19, 2016 Report Share Posted May 19, 2016 You are welcome Collimatrix . Just to expand on my answer, I forgot to mention that I have seen a number of old fashioned looking Soviet light trucks, each mounting Swatter AT-2 ATGMs, which were captured from Egypt in 1967.(One of the advantages of being an old git, is that you have lived long enough to have seen a lot. My problem nowadays, is remembering it)! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted May 19, 2016 Report Share Posted May 19, 2016 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted May 20, 2016 Report Share Posted May 20, 2016 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter_Sobchak Posted May 29, 2016 Report Share Posted May 29, 2016 Russia has agreed to give Israel back an M48 Magach tank that was on display at Kubinka. This vehicle was captured in Lebanon by Syrian forces in 1982 and then given to the USSR. https://tankandafvnews.com/2016/05/29/russia-to-return-israeli-magach-tank-captured-in-1982/ Belesarius 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeeps_Guns_Tanks Posted May 29, 2016 Report Share Posted May 29, 2016 Russia has agreed to give Israel back an M48 Magach tank that was on display at Kubinka. This vehicle was captured in Lebanon by Syrian forces in 1982 and then given to the USSR. https://tankandafvnews.com/2016/05/29/russia-to-return-israeli-magach-tank-captured-in-1982/ That seems odd, why would Israel care? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter_Sobchak Posted May 29, 2016 Report Share Posted May 29, 2016 That seems odd, why would Israel care? It's more about the three missing tankers that went with this vehicle. Reportedly, the tank arrived in the Soviet Union still containing human remains, personal belongings and documents belonging to the tank's crew. Russia denies this was the case saying no human remains or crew items were in the vehicle when they received it. I would assume that even if it were true, such objects would have been removed from the vehicle before it was put on display so I'm not really sure what the Israelis hope to gain from it. Still, Israel has been asking for this vehicle for a long time, it makes sense for the Russians to return it as a diplomatic gesture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsh Posted May 30, 2016 Report Share Posted May 30, 2016 It's more about the three missing tankers that went with this vehicle. Reportedly, the tank arrived in the Soviet Union still containing human remains, personal belongings and documents belonging to the tank's crew. Russia denies this was the case saying no human remains or crew items were in the vehicle when they received it. I would assume that even if it were true, such objects would have been removed from the vehicle before it was put on display so I'm not really sure what the Israelis hope to gain from it. Still, Israel has been asking for this vehicle for a long time, it makes sense for the Russians to return it as a diplomatic gesture. As Walter has said. It's more to do with the missing crewmen than the tank. It's the same MIA thing common to most Western societies. The families still think the crew may be alive and/or want some form of closure. Two Magachs were captured. Three crew members were not accounted for. There are grainy clips of film from 1982 showing one of the Magachs being driven through the streets of Damascus, with three apparently alive, but wounded, crew members being exhibited on the outside of the vehicle. The Syrian authorities since then have blankly denied any knowledge of the fate of the crew members. The Israelis want to ascertain if it was the same vehicle being driven through Damascus and if it is the vehicle belonging to the missing soldiers. It won't bring the crewmen back, but might fill in some of the missing jigsaw pieces. cheers Marsh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted May 30, 2016 Report Share Posted May 30, 2016 Yuri Pasholok take on situation: http://yuripasholok.livejournal.com/6375651.html http://yuripasholok.livejournal.com/6377455.html He claims that story about human remains is complete baize, that was spread by one particular worker of museum. Second link shows that museum workers wanted to get same tank and first version of Merkava-3 for that Magach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted June 1, 2016 Report Share Posted June 1, 2016 Meil Ruakh APS, very good footage of this APS (test fires). Militarysta 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Militarysta Posted June 1, 2016 Report Share Posted June 1, 2016 My article about APS Trophy/ASPRO-A/Windbreaker etc http://dziennikzbrojny.pl/artykuly/art,5,23,8216,wojska-ladowe,wyposazenie,wiatrowka-dla-merkawy-mk-4-czyli-izraelski-aktywny-system-ochrony-aspro-a-trophy (In polish) and possible to download from oficial Polish Army magazine: https://zbrojni.blob.core.windows.net/pzdata2/TinyMceFiles/PRZEGLAD_03_2015_CC.pdf page 90 in pdf (more about APS but Trophy is shortly present there - in polish too. ,maybe will be usefull for sombody work/thesis, etc ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted June 8, 2016 Report Share Posted June 8, 2016 Magach 3 delivered to Russia. http://360tv.ru/news/izrail-dostavil-v-rossiyu-tank-magah-video-60091/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted June 8, 2016 Report Share Posted June 8, 2016 It seems that this tank is already in Kubinka (unconfirmed). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted June 9, 2016 Report Share Posted June 9, 2016 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted June 9, 2016 Report Share Posted June 9, 2016 lol, colli linked that: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronezhilet Posted June 9, 2016 Report Share Posted June 9, 2016 So Russia and Israel just exchanged two Magach 3 tank so Israel could get that Magach 3 back for research? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsh Posted June 9, 2016 Report Share Posted June 9, 2016 So Russia and Israel just exchanged two Magach 3 tank so Israel could get that Magach 3 back for research? As already mentioned. They do want to search for any evidence of the fate of the captured crewmen. Sadly, any new information is unlikely. I would not be surprised if the returned Magach was to become a memorial for soldiers missing in action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted June 11, 2016 Report Share Posted June 11, 2016 http://otvaga2004.mybb.ru/viewtopic.php?id=1399&p=6#p745989 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted June 13, 2016 Report Share Posted June 13, 2016 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter_Sobchak Posted June 18, 2016 Report Share Posted June 18, 2016 More drama surrounding that M48 from Russia. Experts: Putin Sent Israel the Wrong Missing Tank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted June 18, 2016 Report Share Posted June 18, 2016 That is media noise that have nothing to do with actual situation. The vehicle serial number was known for a long time, AFAIK tank was found to be not a tank with missing crew. And Israel accepted vehicle as participant of that battle, not as evidence for investigation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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