xthetenth Posted June 23, 2015 Report Share Posted June 23, 2015 As will have become apparent to everyone by now, an additional problem with self-defence weapons is that they invariably make even better offensive weapons. This is one conflicting requirement that I honestly have no answer for, other than to look at purely defensive ideas (read: armour) which have major problems of their own. Nuke on a deadman switch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donward Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 How about a catapult that throws bags full of bees? "Don't approach me would-be assailant! I have in my possession a bag of bees!" *throws bees How about a catapult that throws bags full of bees? "Don't approach me would-be assailant! I have in my possession a bag of bees!" *throws bees How about a catapult that throws bags full of bees? "Don't approach me would-be assailant! I have in my possession a bag of bees!" *throws bees How about a catapult that throws bags full of bees? "Don't approach me would-be assailant! I have in my possession a bag of bees!" *throws bees How about a catapult that throws bags full of bees? "Don't approach me would-be assailant! I have in my possession a bag of bees!" *throws bees Priory_of_Sion 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donward Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 Expand in size greatly when threatened. So Tied is always feeling threatened? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xthetenth Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 It has been a steady process mirroring the slow decline of the USSR. Legend says he gained three pants sizes when the Berlin Wall fell. Xlucine 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khand-e Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 But, all these silly ideas aside, we all know what the optimal self defense weapon is anyway. Edit: Also, to verify that everything in this post is undeniably true, I defy you to dispute this cold hard evidence! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xlucine Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 That is not an obrez, so you are wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khand-e Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 That is not an obrez, so you are wrong Pffft, have fun fighting off volley firing burglars besieging your house from the high ground with THAT! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priory_of_Sion Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 Pffft, have fun fighting off volley firing burglars besieging your house from the high ground with THAT! What if those burglars are attacked by bees? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khand-e Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 What if those burglars are attacked by bees? Do the bees have stingers 0.65mm in diameter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priory_of_Sion Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 Do the bees have stingers 0.65mm in diameter? If you add all the bee stingers up together... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxn Posted June 24, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 Running the numbers on explosive rounds, I worked out a large-bore cartridge with a similar length and powder charge to 9x19mm. 15x14mm HE would carry about a gram of explosives (assuming a thin, double-walled shell design), weigh in at close to 12 grams and move at something like 200m/s. A single stack ultra-compact could carry 6 rounds, which should be enough to kill one thing exceedingly dead. As an additional bonus, you could probably make a pretty effective hollow-point given all the bullet space you have to work with. Plus, the bigger-is-better crowd might finally be satisfied. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostCosmonaut Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 Do the bees have stingers 0.65mm in diameter? 0.68mm, actually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrashbotUS Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 I find being an intolerable curmudgeon keeps everyone, including ne'er-do-well types away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sturgeon Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 Welcome to the forum, Crashbot! CrashbotUS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnsignExpendable Posted June 24, 2015 Report Share Posted June 24, 2015 Perhaps the most important self defense weapon is the Edit: I was wrong Khand-e 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xlucine Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 Running the numbers on explosive rounds, I worked out a large-bore cartridge with a similar length and powder charge to 9x19mm. 15x14mm HE would carry about a gram of explosives (assuming a thin, double-walled shell design), weigh in at close to 12 grams and move at something like 200m/s. A single stack ultra-compact could carry 6 rounds, which should be enough to kill one thing exceedingly dead. As an additional bonus, you could probably make a pretty effective hollow-point given all the bullet space you have to work with. Plus, the bigger-is-better crowd might finally be satisfied. Hollow points need velocity to expand happily. Am I the only one reminded of WH40K bolters? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxn Posted July 2, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 Hollow points need velocity to expand happily. Am I the only one reminded of WH40K bolters? They do, but it is also easier to make one do so when you have more material to work with. A paper-thin shell of soft brass and a nose cap acting as an opener would be perfectly viable here. Plus, your projectile is already occupying the same volume as a fully opened 9mm hollowpoint. So it doesn't have to do much to be just as (in)effective. People with more firearms knowledge; what do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sturgeon Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 They do, but it is also easier to make one do so when you have more material to work with. A paper-thin shell of soft brass and a nose cap acting as an opener would be perfectly viable here. Plus, your projectile is already occupying the same volume as a fully opened 9mm hollowpoint. So it doesn't have to do much to be just as (in)effective. People with more firearms knowledge; what do you think? Honestly, I have no idea what it is you're actually envisioning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxn Posted July 2, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 Apparently nothing sensible I was asking more learned folk if having a larger projectile allowed one more leeway in terms of designing an expanding round. Do material and manufacturing constraints limit how well a hollow point works? Or is it simply a function of the available energy needed to open the thing up versus the amount of material required to stop it from coming apart in the barrel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sturgeon Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 Apparently nothing sensible I was asking more learned folk if having a larger projectile allowed one more leeway in terms of designing an expanding round. Do material and manufacturing constraints limit how well a hollow point works? Or is it simply a function of the available energy needed to open the thing up versus the amount of material required to stop it from coming apart in the barrel? So, clearly, larger projectiles don't shrink. However, they come with a cost, which is weight and diameter. Further, if a projectile is short and fat enough, it may actually crush less area when it turns sideways (which it will - it's a matter of when). At this point, we've gotten really good at JHP design, and the arguments to be made for larger-caliber projos grow thin. At one point, maybe you could argue for a nice .45 LC flat nosed being more effective than 9mm, but that's not really the case today. To break up a jacketed projo in a barrel takes like 4,500-5,000 ft/s velocity, unless your alloys are crap. So there's no worry of that. What you are trying to balance with JHP projo design is how deep the round penetrates vs. how much it expands. At this point, the cartridge with more energy will have more figurative material to work with to both expand dramatically and penetrate deeply, but that does not mean a less energetic round cannot perform just as well in certain circumstances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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