Bash the F-35 thred.

[Sturgeon]

Key West. The dumbest motherfucking thing about our military.

[Toxn]

3 hours ago, Sturgeon said:

Key West. The dumbest motherfucking thing about our military.

Indeed.

On the one hand, it's an attempt to prevent redundancy of forces. On the other, you have that anyway (to a meta degree with the marines) and the whole thing is retarded.

 

[Sturgeon]

Just now, Toxn said:

Indeed.

On the one hand, it's an attempt to prevent redundancy of forces. On the other, you have that anyway (to a meta degree with the marines) and the whole thing is retarded.

 

Let's not get confused: Preventing redundancy was the excuse. The real reason was that the Air Force had only recently become a separate branch, and they didn't want the Army stepping on their toes.

[Toxn]

20 minutes ago, Sturgeon said:

Let's not get confused: Preventing redundancy was the excuse. The real reason was that the Air Force had only recently become a separate branch, and they didn't want the Army stepping on their toes.

Oh certainly. And from the other end; you know that the army would have had a strategic air wing if they thought they could get away with it.

 

But preventing redundancy isn't a bad concept in and of itself.

[roguetechie]

It just worked out fucking terribly in the instance of Key West.

TBH I think that some amount of redundancy and "overlap" when it comes to the military technology the various branches use is a good thing when managed correctly.

Especially since it means that a potential foe has to try and engineer systems capable of dealing with multiple multiple approaches to the same problem.

It's a fine line though, diversify too much and you water stuff down too much. Diversify too little and ONE really good solution nullifies an entire class or type of system.

[Donward]

So Trump in his speech to Congress just now mentioned the F-35, talked about bringing down the price and basically called it a great, great plane.

This is a darn good indicator that the original fears of Trump going budget hawk and eliminating the program are less likely.

When the transcript is up, we'll see if we can't get a link.

[Sturgeon]

49 minutes ago, Donward said:

So Trump in his speech to Congress just now mentioned the F-35, talked about bringing down the price and basically called it a great, great plane.

This is a darn good indicator that the original fears of Trump going budget hawk and eliminating the program are less likely.

When the transcript is up, we'll see if we can't get a link.

I told people he wouldn't kill it.

[That’s Suspicious]

Well he can't kill it right? It's already too enveloped in our economy and military and those of other nations as well.

[Sturgeon]

1 hour ago, Conner Webb said:

Well he can't kill it right? It's already too enveloped in our economy and military and those of other nations as well.

A lot of people hoped and prayed.

Also, you forgot "it's a fucking great jet".

[Donward]

The F-35 has come a long ways since the days where it had a 0:1 K/D ratio versus semi-trucks.

 

[Collimatrix]

[Bronezhilet]

That post is empty for me, Colli.

[roguetechie]

Sturgeon,

I genuinely hope you are right and the stuff I've been worried about turns out to be 100% ground less.

One thing that has always bothered me is the malicious glee some F35 detractors exude every time word of a problem comes out.

I personally still remain skeptical of the plane for my own reasons which range from technical to just plain thinking that the X32 was sexier, but I also don't have the access to know if my concerns are valid.

In the mean time I'm choosing conditional optimism for no other reason than the implications of thinking anything else are really damn depressing.

[Sturgeon]

15 minutes ago, roguetechie said:

Sturgeon,

I genuinely hope you are right and the stuff I've been worried about turns out to be 100% ground less.

One thing that has always bothered me is the malicious glee some F35 detractors exude every time word of a problem comes out.

I personally still remain skeptical of the plane for my own reasons which range from technical to just plain thinking that the X32 was sexier, but I also don't have the access to know if my concerns are valid.

In the mean time I'm choosing conditional optimism for no other reason than the implications of thinking anything else are really damn depressing.

What pisses me off the most is how consistently retarded critics of the F-35 are. We need good critics of the F-35, it's an enormous program with equal potential for graft and corruption! But the critics know nothing, such a bunch of paste-eating FAS-suffering retards that they are.

[roguetechie]

ROFLMFAO

I made a comment on above top secret the other day calling one out for being just that...

I also dropped the truth bomb of stealth not being a binary thing. The whole idea that it just works or doesn't work with no middle ground COMPLETELY ignores everything written about stealth by people who know about stealth in the public arena since at least the late 90's!

I'm sure several of you are thinking why the f*** do you post on ATS?

tradition mostly... It was my home base on the internet since early 2001, and the site I was on that shitty day in September while doing inbound tech support and sales for McAfee. (Weird fucking day, weird couple of months before that! 15 years later and I'm still very conflicted, angsty, and disturbed by stuff that happened that day and the few months before and after)

 

Plus the wehraboo hunting there is like going to texas to hunt feral pigs.

[Ramlaen]

http://www.airforcesmonthly.com/2017/03/07/have-israels-new-f-35s-seen-combat/

Quote

According to a French journalist, Israel’s newly received F-35A Adir stealth fighters have already seen combat. Reportedly, a first air strike was flown against targets in Syria in January – less than a month after the jets first touched down in Israel.

Georges Malbrunot, who writes for French newspaper Le Figaro, cited French intelligence sources. He posted on Twitter today that examples of the Israeli F-35 – two of which have been delivered to the country to date – took part in a raid over Syrian territory on the night of January 12-13. The mission saw them strike objectives around the capital, Damascus.

According to Malbrunot, the F-35s targeted warehouses containing Russian-made Pantsir-S1 mobile surface-to-air missile (SAM) systems that Israel feared could be delivered from Syria to Hezbollah forces operating in Lebanon. The warehouse was located at Mezzeh, a military airfield in Damascus.

 

[Ramlaen]

On 3/2/2017 at 9:32 PM, Collimatrix said:

I didn't realize before but the pod appears to block the view of the lower rear DAS camera, which would explain why the centerline is reserved for specialized tasks.

Edited March 8, 2017 by Ramlaen

[LoooSeR]

On 08.03.2017 at 4:17 AM, Ramlaen said:

http://www.airforcesmonthly.com/2017/03/07/have-israels-new-f-35s-seen-combat/

 

This is so full of BS that it is not even funny. Pantsirs to Lebanon? To Hezbollah? This is same idiocy like with Yakhont missiles. At least DEBKA didn't run a story about Hezbollah and T-90A tanks, Hezbollah and Msta-S, Hezbollah receiving Ka-52s and so on.

[Mighty_Zuk]

7 hours ago, LoooSeR said:

This is so full of BS that it is not even funny. Pantsirs to Lebanon? To Hezbollah? This is same idiocy like with Yakhont missiles. At least DEBKA didn't run a story about Hezbollah and T-90A tanks, Hezbollah and Msta-S, Hezbollah receiving Ka-52s and so on.

While the story is definitely BS, because when it happened, Israel was only talking about ground launched long range missiles (EXTRA, Predator Hawk, LORA) as a replacement for some air force missions, and it's very likely it was done by such long range rocket. Not to mention the idiotic S-300 remark.

But given Syria's transfers of advanced Russian weaponry to Hezbollah, it's not surprising they were trying to transfer a Pantsir. Almost every air strike that Israel conducted in Syria in the past few years has been exclusively against advanced air defense systems.

[LoooSeR]

23 minutes ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

While the story is definitely BS, because when it happened, Israel was only talking about ground launched long range missiles (EXTRA, Predator Hawk, LORA) as a replacement for some air force missions, and it's very likely it was done by such long range rocket. Not to mention the idiotic S-300 remark.

But given Syria's transfers of advanced Russian weaponry to Hezbollah, it's not surprising they were trying to transfer a Pantsir. Almost every air strike that Israel conducted in Syria in the past few years has been exclusively against advanced air defense systems.

??? The only Russian-made weapon Syrians trasfered to Al-Mukowama are some old ass T-55s with several T-72AVs and Shilka for Al-Mukowama operations during 2013 and 2014. AL-Mukowama have no resources to support anything more sophisticated, this f cking organisations does npt simply have money and specialists to get any of those systems. I am not even talking about non-existant benefits from getting those AA systems. 

[Mighty_Zuk]

Where do you think their Kornets, Grads, Fateh, Zelzal, as well as personal gear and ammunition is coming from? It's all from Iran (copies) and goes through Syria. Sometimes even Russian "gifts" to SAA find their way to Hezbollah's hands. 

All their financial aid and military aid is coming from Iran, and IRGC was caught sending advisors to Lebanon to assist Hezbollah. 

 

They don't even need to shoot down any warplane or helicopter to make effective use of these AA systems and let me explain; simply by activating the system's radar and locking onto an aircraft, for just a few moments, would alert the aircraft of a nearby threat and prompt it to delay its strike mission on the given target. This is essential is Hezbollah means to effectively play its hide and seek game with its thousands of rocket launcher spots. 

Hamas did the same thing by firing some cheap AA (obviously didn't hit anything), that caused IAF warplanes to delay their given missions. It was reported that in 2014, 96 strike missions were SEAD. 

[LoooSeR]

24 minutes ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

Where do you think their Kornets, Grads, Fateh, Zelzal, as well as personal gear and ammunition is coming from? It's all from Iran (copies) and goes through Syria. Sometimes even Russian "gifts" to SAA find their way to Hezbollah's hands. 

All their financial aid and military aid is coming from Iran, and IRGC was caught sending advisors to Lebanon to assist Hezbollah. 

 

They don't even need to shoot down any warplane or helicopter to make effective use of these AA systems and let me explain; simply by activating the system's radar and locking onto an aircraft, for just a few moments, would alert the aircraft of a nearby threat and prompt it to delay its strike mission on the given target. This is essential is Hezbollah means to effectively play its hide and seek game with its thousands of rocket launcher spots. 

Hamas did the same thing by firing some cheap AA (obviously didn't hit anything), that caused IAF warplanes to delay their given missions. It was reported that in 2014, 96 strike missions were SEAD. 

I know thing or 2 about Hezbollah, don't bother to explain me it. Open discussion -> Al-Mukowama thread, we can continue there. 

[Donward]

The budget hawks at National Review are at it again.

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/445708/f-35-replacement-f-45-mustang-ii-fighter-simple-lightweight

"When replacing the failed F-35, the U.S. should focus on building large numbers of a reliable, lightweight fighter design."

‘Simplicate and Add Lightness!’ — Designing the F-45 Mustang II

 

[Sturgeon]

Oh man that looks delicious. Can't wait to get me a piece of that.

[Donward]

They name it the F-45 because anything with the number 45 in it will have MOAR STOPPING POWAH!

But seriously that article is the type of shit conventional thinking which costs soldiers lives and increases production costs.