Syrian conflict.

[Donward]

But Muh Strawman arguments!

 

Also LOL at the "Occupied" Golan Heights.

[LoooSeR]

1 hour ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

When did he push for an invasion into Iraq? And when did he push to overthrow Assad?

2 seconds of googling

 

"and advised Congress that a U.S. invasion of Iraq would be "a good choice.""

[LoooSeR]

1 hour ago, Donward said:

But Muh Strawman arguments!

 

Also LOL at the "Occupied" Golan Heights.

 

Quote

The United States considers the Golan Heights to be Syrian territory held under Israeli occupation subject to negotiation and Israeli withdrawal.

 

[Mighty_Zuk]

13 minutes ago, LoooSeR said:

"and advised Congress that a U.S. invasion of Iraq would be "a good choice.""

 

Video title is misleading, he wasn't a PM back then, but he did say during the video that the information he relied on was the one he had access to during his term, which ended in 1999. Perhaps the possibility of Iraq developing WMDs was considered real back then.

A decapitation of Iraq's leadership, i.e Saddam Hussein, is known to have long been in Israel's plans. Iraq was still viewed as no less of a threat than Syria or Egypt or Jordan back when the wars raged on, as they would send masses of troops and support during wartime. RAFAEL was tasked with the development of a weapon to do this. They called it Tamuz in Hebrew, and Spike NLOS in English. Whole thing went bust when they accidentally test fired a live missile which ended up killing a bunch of folks. 

 

But Syria? Nah. At least I've never heard of this.

 

11 minutes ago, LoooSeR said:

 

The United States considers the Golan Heights to be Syrian territory held under Israeli occupation subject to negotiation and Israeli withdrawal.

 

Yet that didn't really work. The withdrawal from the Golan Heights was negotiated during Olmert's term as PM. Israel demanded in return that a comprehensive peace plan will be signed, but also that Iran will not be allowed to have presence in Syria. Obviously the Syrians refused to that, likely because they wanted Iranian support. 

But today, even if some negotiations will restart, I don't think anyone in their right mind would support such a move, where Assad would gain the Golan heights. He just cannot be trusted with them.

[Donward]

Israel has "Occupied" the Golan Heights longer than Syria ever controlled them. It's been 51 years.

[LoooSeR]

 

 

Photo of that Pantsir.

[Mighty_Zuk]

55 minutes ago, LoooSeR said:

-snip-

 

Photo of that Pantsir.

 

Gotta love how Russian sources, as well as occasionally Syrian ones, try to just completely speculate what the missiles were without even doing the slightest effort to verify.

The IDF doesn't use the IAI Harop.

The IDF doesn't use the SkySniper.

The IDF doesn't use the Extra, Predator Hawk, or LORA.

And the IDF certainly won't use Jericho missiles unless it's a nuclear war.

[Sgt.Squarehead]

6 hours ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

Israel demanded in return that a comprehensive peace plan will be signed, but also that Iran will not be allowed to have presence in Syria. Obviously the Syrians refused to that, likely because they wanted Iranian support. 

 

See, that's the bit Israel doesn't get.....You don't get anything in return for ceasing to violate international law.  Sorry, that's just how it is, or rather it's how it should be.  It's like a burglar expecting the courts to force you to pay him for leaving your property.

 

Also Israel doesn't get a say in who has influence in other nations, that's not how that works either.....Now I know Israel hasn't had much time to learn the diplomatic niceties that come with nationhood, but this is pretty elementary stuff.

[Ramlaen]

6 hours ago, LoooSeR said:

Photo of that Pantsir.

 

Regarding the video and the after picture.

 

-the radar was upright but not spinning, indicating it was off

-the kamikaze drone struck the bed of the truck, not the cab

if the missiles were expended why did they char the end of their tubes like they caught fire after being hit After reviewing video they do dirty up their tubes like that when firing.

 

Seems pretty straightforward that they got caught with their pants down, which isn't a reflection of the capability of a Pantsir.

[Ramlaen]

2 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said:

 

It's like a burglar expecting the courts to force you to pay him for leaving your property.

 

This is a terrible analogy by the way, unless you think Syria was a victim in the Six Day war.

[Jeeps_Guns_Tanks]

10 hours ago, LoooSeR said:

 

 

The United States considers the Golan Heights to be Syrian territory held under Israeli occupation subject to negotiation and Israeli withdrawal.

 

I bet the Trump stance on this is very different. 

[Mighty_Zuk]

8 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said:

 

See, that's the bit Israel doesn't get.....You don't get anything in return for ceasing to violate international law.  Sorry, that's just how it is, or rather it's how it should be.  It's like a burglar expecting the courts to force you to pay him for leaving your property.

 

Also Israel doesn't get a say in who has influence in other nations, that's not how that works either.....Now I know Israel hasn't had much time to learn the diplomatic niceties that come with nationhood, but this is pretty elementary stuff.

 

There are many ways to interpret the law, but there is one thing certain:

You don't start shit you cant finish.

 

The Syrians were at war with the Israelis. That's fine. In 1948 they knew Israel was very weak, and its territory was ripe for taking. At the time it seemed like the right strategic move.

 

But when they started draining Israel's water sources and firing on Israeli towns with artillery that was very hard to hit back (due to the altitude, the Golan Heights were a strategic position for artillery), they should have at least taken into account a possibility in which they would lose. 

 

But apparently in the Arab world it's the pride that trumps everything. That's why nearly every Arab country that isn't a major oil exporting state, is so underdeveloped, while Israel is pretty much like an average Western European country on the development index.

 

Assad could get the Golan through diplomacy. Now, if he wants it back, he can rile up as many man as possible and try to retake it by force. 

 

Again, don't start shit you can't finish.

 

6 hours ago, Ramlaen said:

 

Regarding the video and the after picture.

 

-the radar was upright but not spinning, indicating it was off

-the kamikaze drone struck the bed of the truck, not the cab

if the missiles were expended why did they char the end of their tubes like they caught fire after being hit After reviewing video they do dirty up their tubes like that when firing.

 

Seems pretty straightforward that they got caught with their pants down, which isn't a reflection of the capability of a Pantsir.

 

That is, if that Pantsir worked alone. Aren't there supposed to be batteries of these things? If there was a whole battery, then either they all expended their missiles, which indicates a massive failure to hit cruise missiles and PGMs, or they really don't know how to manage munitions.

[LoooSeR]

13 hours ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

 

Gotta love how Russian sources, as well as occasionally Syrian ones, try to just completely speculate what the missiles were without even doing the slightest effort to verify.

The IDF doesn't use the IAI Harop.

The IDF doesn't use the SkySniper.

The IDF doesn't use the Extra, Predator Hawk, or LORA.

And the IDF certainly won't use Jericho missiles unless it's a nuclear war.

Video is from Wael, who reported about that Pantsir first in his twitter.

There were no "Russian sources" about this event, at least far from being first and IIRC MoD didn't reported details.

 

7 hours ago, Ramlaen said:

 

Regarding the video and the after picture.

 

-the radar was upright but not spinning, indicating it was off

-the kamikaze drone struck the bed of the truck, not the cab

if the missiles were expended why did they char the end of their tubes like they caught fire after being hit After reviewing video they do dirty up their tubes like that when firing.

 

Seems pretty straightforward that they got caught with their pants down, which isn't a reflection of the capability of a Pantsir.

Cabin could mean crew cabin, not driver place

 

   From US/Coalition cruise missile strike Pantsir's missile containers after firing:

+

1 hour ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

.....

That is, if that Pantsir worked alone. Aren't there supposed to be batteries of these things? If there was a whole battery, then either they all expended their missiles, which indicates a massive failure to hit cruise missiles and PGMs, or they really don't know how to manage munitions.

   I will not be surprised if they had just one Pantsir on that AB in total. Syrian AA is incomplete, which is why they showed mediocre results (including US/Coalition cruise missile strike with ~65% intercepted missiles) and thats why there are talks about S-300.

   And yes, Wael wrote that Pantsir was being reloaded in his first twitt.

 

16 hours ago, Donward said:

Israel has "Occupied" the Golan Heights longer than Syria ever controlled them. It's been 51 years.

Didn't changed legal (or illegal) status, thought.

 

7 hours ago, Ramlaen said:

This is a terrible analogy by the way, unless you think Syria was a victim in the Six Day war.

Agree. And Syrians fucked up themselfs with that.

 

6 hours ago, Jeeps_Guns_Tanks said:

I bet the Trump stance on this is very different. 

   Of course, as a lot of politicians in US, i think. A bit unrelated - in light of Iranian deal flushed down the toilet, it will be interesting to see reaction (or no reaction) from North Korea.

 

 

 

 

[Mighty_Zuk]

12 minutes ago, LoooSeR said:

Video is from Wael, who reported about that Pantsir first in his twitter.

There were no "Russian sources" about this event, at least far from being first and IIRC MoD didn't reported details.

 

Maybe not about this event, but I do remember in one of the past incidents, just casually watching the news, seeing an out-of-the-blue claim that a SkySniper missile was used against some SAM installation. That was Russian TV by the way, and I have seen enough claims about ground based long range rockets.

[Mighty_Zuk]

Also, 11 Iranian dead:

https://www.timesofisrael.com/11-iranians-among-dead-in-israels-strikes-in-syria-monitor-says/

[LoooSeR]

55 minutes ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

Also, 11 Iranian dead:

https://www.timesofisrael.com/11-iranians-among-dead-in-israels-strikes-in-syria-monitor-says/

 

Quote

Syrian Observatory for Human Rights says

   Well, time to post DEBKA here as well, i guess. Syrian Observatory for Human Rights is a "source" of very questinable quality. I try to avoid any information from this source, as much as from Al-Masdar and few others.

 

Another such POS:

Quote

@AmirTaheri4
TEHRAN- So far bodies of 14 Iranian officers killed in Israeli attacks on Iranian bases in Syria have arrived. They will be buried quietly in their native towns. Unlike previous occasions this time there will be no pomp and ceremony. Media ordered to hush-up the whole thing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amir_Taheri

 

And still, no good info on casualities of Iranians, if we don't count "Iranians" i posted earlier.

[LoooSeR]

59 minutes ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

 

Maybe not about this event, but I do remember in one of the past incidents, just casually watching the news, seeing an out-of-the-blue claim that a SkySniper missile was used against some SAM installation. That was Russian TV by the way, and I have seen enough claims about ground based long range rockets.

https://imp-navigator.livejournal.com/730342.html

Yuri Lyamin is very good expert on ME.

Quote

   Something I saw at different sites - a speculations of what weapon system desotryed Syrian "Pantsir-S1". Some say that it was Spike, others - the UAV-kamikaze Harop. However, the Mezze airbase is generally outside the range of Spike NLOS, from the Mezze airbase to the nearest Israeli positions more than 40 km. But the most important thing is that if you look at the frames of the launch of different missiles, you can clearly see that the picture with a black cross of the sight and a black dot is typical for the picture from the Delilah cruise missile camera, with the Iranian mobile control center of the UAV at T4 airbase in February this year, that was when the Israeli F-16I, which participated in the raid, was shot down.

 

   For comparison.
Destruction of the Syrian "Pantsir-S1"

 

Destruction of the Iranian mobile control center of the UAV

 

And these are the frames from the previously known cases of the Delilah CM uses

/..../

 

[LoooSeR]

Quote

As part of the economic assistance to Syria, Iranian engineers built a new electrical substation near Aleppo

[LoooSeR]

HTS&Co did small attack on Fua and Kefraya, was repelled

[LoooSeR]

[LoooSeR]

 

About the strike:

Quote

5N62V illumination radar of S-200 SAM, apparently destroyed in Israeli strike.

 

Spoiler

 

 

[LoooSeR]

Quote

One of the rockets fired by the Israeli enemy at dawn today, possibly a LORA rocket.

The Russians said that 10 Israeli surface-to-surface missiles were launched during their aggression at dawn.

 

Spoiler

Whatever it is, reported that was found after Isreali attack.

[Mighty_Zuk]

40 minutes ago, LoooSeR said:

 

   Well, time to post DEBKA here as well, i guess. Syrian Observatory for Human Rights is a "source" of very questinable quality. I try to avoid any information from this source, as much as from Al-Masdar and few others.

 

Another such POS:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amir_Taheri

 

And still, no good info on casualities of Iranians, if we don't count "Iranians" i posted earlier.

 

I've heard thus far that they are biased in the numbers given, but I'm not too sure who they are biased for and against.

 

5 minutes ago, LoooSeR said:

Spoiler

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Whatever it is, reported that was found after Isreali attack.

 

Doesn't seem to be any type of Israeli munition that I know of. Could be one of the many SAMs they fired?

 

35 minutes ago, LoooSeR said:

https://imp-navigator.livejournal.com/730342.html

Yuri Lyamin is very good expert on ME.

 

And he is the only one so far that I've seen that made an actual assessment based on facts, and not some randomly chosen munition. Kudos to him.

[LoooSeR]

3 minutes ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

I've heard thus far that they are biased in the numbers given, but I'm not too sure who they are biased for and against.

 

 

Doesn't seem to be any type of Israeli munition that I know of. Could be one of the many SAMs they fired?

 

And he is the only one so far that I've seen that made an actual assessment based on facts, and not some randomly chosen munition. Kudos to him.

1) Syrian Observatory for Human Rights is in London, so it should be obvious.

 

2) IDK, didn't bother to check.

 

3) Maybe thats why i follow him. 

[LoooSeR]

Quote

NEW MAP: The evacuation process of the last "rebels" in/near #Damascus has been completed. #Babbila, #BeitSahm and #SidiMiqdat are now under  full Government control. Pressure on remaining #ISIS forces in #Yarmouk  Camp area will likely increase now. #Syria