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16 minutes ago, Walter_Sobchak said:

opps, I figured since I was kinda late to the party on this one that spoilers were being discussed.  

 

The force can also save you from the cold vacuum of space and pull you back into a space ship.  

I thought that was how they were retconning Carrie Fisher's death. 

 

And it would have made sense. Emo Ren hesitating to kill his mom, his wingman doing it instead, Kylo regretting it. It would have made sense from a narrative perspective.

 

So OF COURSE they fucked it up and had her live.

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57 minutes ago, Sturgeon said:

 

Who the fuck knows anymore. We've seen like 3 or 4 different kinds of target effects from blasters over the whole series.

 

At one point in the prequels IIRC, a blaster was shown producing an extremely high rate of fire (~2000 RPM) with basically no recoil. This would seem to be the salient advantage of a blaster, but it's almost never shown in use.

I like how it took 30 years for someone to remember that blasters have a stun feature. That feature would have come in handy - ohhhhhhhh... - about a half dozen times.

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The part of the story with Ray, Luke and Kylo/Ben was fairly good (although I think Luke's behavior doesn't fit his character from the original trilogy). The slow speed chase was just bad writing and plot holes from start to finish.

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34 minutes ago, Ramlaen said:

The part of the story with Ray, Luke and Kylo/Ben was fairly good (although I think Luke's behavior doesn't fit his character from the original trilogy). The slow speed chase was just bad writing and plot holes from start to finish.

 

Agreed with all of this. The Emo Ren/Rey "Hey let's kill my Sith master on our first date" bit was pretty good.

 

Also, the Empire Strikes Back redo space chase scene in this film was so boring and sucked so much, the screen writers had to send Finn and Weepy Chubby Asian Chick to Casino Planet in order to hang out with orphan waifs. Because focusing on orphan waifs worked so well before in Star Wars.

 

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The entire "chase" premise was ridiculous.  Doesn't the Empire have other ships in their fleet that could have intercepted the rebel fleet from a different direction?  

 

Anyhow, the Empire should get over their fixation with battleships and start building more escort carriers.  

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So, I haven't seen this new movie yet.  I did, however, see the first of the reboots in 2015.  Given what I saw, here is what I would expect:

 

-Ep 7 showed that, somehow, things had returned to the status quo ante of Ep 6.  There's a big, evil empire being opposed by a small, plucky rebellion.  Only they're not called that, they're called something different.  The explanation for how this happened was omitted in Ep 7 and I was fine with this, I figured they would get into it in Ep 8.  I wasn't expecting an Ayn Rand esque dissertation on the matter, but maybe a few lines here and there explaining a bit more of how A got to B.  Did this happen?

 

-Ep 7 had this spooky evil dude who got very little screen time and who was very mysterious.  Again, I was fine with this and assumed that Ep 8 would build him up more, possibly with a scene of him gassing an entire planet of puppies while muttering that this is good because his only weakness is puppies because of his dark, puppy-related past.  This would pay off in Ep 9 when he would be tackled by a huge wall of lava-resistant puppies into a volcano.  Again, this would seem like fairly elementary story-telling.  Set-up and pay-off.  Did this happen?

-Ep 7 had this weird paucity of spacecraft, which seemed odd in this CGI era.  One thing (possibly the only thing) that Ep 3 did well was show the mind-crushing scale of warfare in this setting.  There's this gargantuan battle going on that seems to surround an entire planet.  There are spaceships shooting at each other farther than the eye can see, it just sort of blends off into flashing light in the background.  It's momentary pretty impressive.  Then the actors start talking and you remember that the movie is horrible.  But for just a bit, you can appreciate it as a story about individual actors with their own personal drama who are caught up in an inconceivably vast war.  There are lots of stories like that.  Is Ep 8 keeping with the more minimalist aesthetic?

 

 

Basically, I'm curious if this film follows logically from the things that were set up in Ep 7.  Because Ep 7 had every indication of being a very by-the-books, safe sort of story.  It had obviously under-developed ideas that were intentionally being left for sequels.  It felt like absolutely orthodox and linear movie-making.  None of this particularly strays from the original vision, of course, Lucas is famously a believer in Campbell's monomyth idea.  If you make a Star Wars film and it sort of feels like a bunch of other films at once that's a vindication of the thesis.

 

So, I had full faith and confidence that Disney could figure out how to mass-produce Star Wars films.  But it's sounding like maybe that isn't the case.

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Does the forum have a spoiler tag?

 

 
  1. "Buy the books" - Disney 2017
  2. Kylo cuts him in half in the 2nd act, then teams up with Rey to kill all of his Praetorians. Basically nothing more is said about Snoke.
  3. The opening scene has a handful of fighters escort five to seven heavy bombers WWII style to bomb the heart of a Star Dreadnought(It has two big planet bombarding guns on the bottom side). There's basically no space combat after this 5 minute scene
  4. Rey's parents are irrelevant. The Knights of Ren are irrelevant. Whether or not they're the padawans Kylo took with him from Luke's temple are irrelevant. The vision of Kylo and others standing in the rain that Rey sees during the lightsaber vision are irrelevant. The significance of Anakin's lightsaber is irrelevant for this film at least. The destruction of Starkiller Base is irrelevant. The Republic is irrelevant. How and when Snoke drew Kylo to the dark side is irrelevant. How Rey is so Force sensitive is irrelevant. How Rey is so good at everything is irrelevant. Why Obi-Wan was speaking through the Force to Rey when she picked up Anakin's lightsaber is irrelevant. Captain Phasma is irrelevant. Finally, as far as the Galaxy is concerned, The Resistance and their fight against The First Order is irrelevant.

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5 hours ago, Collimatrix said:

So, I haven't seen this new movie yet.  I did, however, see the first of the reboots in 2015.  Given what I saw, here is what I would expect:

 

-Ep 7 showed that, somehow, things had returned to the status quo ante of Ep 6.  There's a big, evil empire being opposed by a small, plucky rebellion.  Only they're not called that, they're called something different.  The explanation for how this happened was omitted in Ep 7 and I was fine with this, I figured they would get into it in Ep 8.  I wasn't expecting an Ayn Rand esque dissertation on the matter, but maybe a few lines here and there explaining a bit more of how A got to B.  Did this happen?

 

-Ep 7 had this spooky evil dude who got very little screen time and who was very mysterious.  Again, I was fine with this and assumed that Ep 8 would build him up more, possibly with a scene of him gassing an entire planet of puppies while muttering that this is good because his only weakness is puppies because of his dark, puppy-related past.  This would pay off in Ep 9 when he would be tackled by a huge wall of lava-resistant puppies into a volcano.  Again, this would seem like fairly elementary story-telling.  Set-up and pay-off.  Did this happen?

-Ep 7 had this weird paucity of spacecraft, which seemed odd in this CGI era.  One thing (possibly the only thing) that Ep 3 did well was show the mind-crushing scale of warfare in this setting.  There's this gargantuan battle going on that seems to surround an entire planet.  There are spaceships shooting at each other farther than the eye can see, it just sort of blends off into flashing light in the background.  It's momentary pretty impressive.  Then the actors start talking and you remember that the movie is horrible.  But for just a bit, you can appreciate it as a story about individual actors with their own personal drama who are caught up in an inconceivably vast war.  There are lots of stories like that.  Is Ep 8 keeping with the more minimalist aesthetic?

 

 

Basically, I'm curious if this film follows logically from the things that were set up in Ep 7.  Because Ep 7 had every indication of being a very by-the-books, safe sort of story.  It had obviously under-developed ideas that were intentionally being left for sequels.  It felt like absolutely orthodox and linear movie-making.  None of this particularly strays from the original vision, of course, Lucas is famously a believer in Campbell's monomyth idea.  If you make a Star Wars film and it sort of feels like a bunch of other films at once that's a vindication of the thesis.

 

So, I had full faith and confidence that Disney could figure out how to mass-produce Star Wars films.  But it's sounding like maybe that isn't the case.

 

The most shocking thing about this film is how bad it is.  Its like they let some guy with barely any experience both write and direct a star wars film without making sure he actually made it fit with the previous film.  Oh wait, that's exactly what they did.  

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What I've seen and read so far has given me the idea that the director could have only watched the last 5-10 minutes of Episode VII and just gone from there.  Probably could have been fine not watching any of the other movies either.

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I'm glad to see other people savage this SJW shitfest....

 

Says a guy who runs around with pretty much nothing but actual real empowered interesting and very tough women, unlike the shitty bitchy little do everything for me expect no credit and no respect for it cunty fifth wave what the fuck evers they murdered my beloved star wars with...

 

Not that I have feelings one way or another about the movie or anything.

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Ok, we have a new winner in the "worst article about star wars" contest.  The write of this one must be either paid on the side by Disney, or perhaps Disney has incriminating photos.  Anyhow, the title of the article is so absurd it's almost on the level of The Onion.

 

Why the Hell Isn’t Anybody Talking About ‘The Last Jedi’ for Best Picture?

 

"Of course, there’s a very simple answer as to why “The Last Jedi” is languishing in the fringes of the Oscar race, left with nothing but a billion dollars to console it. And no, it’s not because of the overheated “backlash” — while it’s obviously true that a certain percentage of sane “Star Wars” fans have yet to accept Rian Johnson’s installment as the summit of the saga (give them time), let’s stop pretending that a pathetic gaggle of racist trolls are an accurate bellwether for one of the most rewarding mega-movies in recent memory. The fact of the matter is that nobody is talking about “The Last Jedi” as a possible Best Picture contender because nobody is talking about “The Last Jedi” as a possible Best Picture contender."

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2 hours ago, Walter_Sobchak said:

Ok, we have a new winner in the "worst article about star wars" contest.  The write of this one must be either paid on the side by Disney, or perhaps Disney has incriminating photos.  Anyhow, the title of the article is so absurd it's almost on the level of The Onion.

 

Why the Hell Isn’t Anybody Talking About ‘The Last Jedi’ for Best Picture?

 

"Of course, there’s a very simple answer as to why “The Last Jedi” is languishing in the fringes of the Oscar race, left with nothing but a billion dollars to console it. And no, it’s not because of the overheated “backlash” — while it’s obviously true that a certain percentage of sane “Star Wars” fans have yet to accept Rian Johnson’s installment as the summit of the saga (give them time), let’s stop pretending that a pathetic gaggle of racist trolls are an accurate bellwether for one of the most rewarding mega-movies in recent memory. The fact of the matter is that nobody is talking about “The Last Jedi” as a possible Best Picture contender because nobody is talking about “The Last Jedi” as a possible Best Picture contender."

 

Given the quality of Hollywood movies of late, it just might be the best one of the fetid lot in 2017.

 

Also, it amuses me that somehow you're racist if you don't enjoy the steaming pile of Bantha crap that is "Last Jedi". I guess we're just supposed to overlook the fact that Hollywood is so devoid of ideas and talent that they can't even make a decent Star Wars movie anymore and have been consistently failing in that task since 1980. 

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Spoiler

There were good bits, there were utterly terrible bits.

 

The opening scene was garbage. Utter garbage. This is a life-or-death struggle, with the empire aiming to kill every man, woman and youngling in the resistance - and they were delayed by that? Tarkin must be rolling in his grave. Also I think rose's sister was the one that managed to actually bomb the floating maguffin, which makes her the most capable bomber crew in the fleet (but that's a bar so low it's in china by now)

 

The low speed chase scene:

- "we're in the middle of nowhere, except for that old rebel base about a days sub-light travel away. We can see it from here!"

- The purple haired HR type: "I'm going to try to make it to that old reinforced base, but tell absolutely no-one because reasons. This is sure to reassure my crew, and prevent mutiny - just telling everyone that they need to hope is enough". She is also a complete asshole in the first scene we see of her for no reason whatsoever.

- Why do blaster cannon follow a ballistic trajectory in space? If a transport can keep out of effective weapons range of a star destroyer, why did so many of them get blown up in the original series? As fake tarkin said, why have all of that if they can't deal with an unarmed transport ship? Just get one of the destroyers to light-speed jump ahead of it!

- Why do the empire need to be reminded to keep scanning for cloaked ships? I think at this stage we're meant to assume that the empire are just ineffectual cosplayers, like airsofters with occasional war crimes (in a similar vein to how kylo was beaten by rey in the first film because he was never properly taught and just jacks off to vader's helmet)

- HR lady had to stay behind to pilot the ship, but just swanned about the bridge melodramatically until it was her turn to an hero

- The empire seems to have an endless supply of ever larger triangles

 

The empire managed to make some magic maguffin that could track ships through hyperspace, and apparently have one on every destroyer, but only use the one on the big ship for reasons (in fairness, we never saw them test that theory). Also fin used to dust the maguffin, but never mentioned it to anyone and was just as surprised as everyone else when the maguffin was used.

 

The casino planet:

- Those orphans were killed after the stable owner found them. Really, that's the only likely course of action.

- The horse things were hunted down and killed too. Rich people found they enjoy hunting those things more than they enjoy racing them, so now vast quantities are bred to populate the landscape with game for the hunt. This is all immeasurably more cruel than the racing ever was.

Tell me this isn't canon, with how that planet was described.

 

The lightspeed crash making a dent in an unprepared ship I could see working, but wrecking a fleet like that it's a fucking WMD - hyperspace travel would be banned for all non-military ships if anyone in the galaxy had any sense. I'm also impressed that the empire managed to pull off a halfhearted landing with all their destroyers wrecked and half their capital ship vented to space & exploding.

 

I kind of like the idea of space toyota hiluxes at light speed becoming the new meta in star wars combat, and beating the death stars on cost-per-planet-destroyer - but only if this actually becomes meta next film.

 

Snoke's guards were very inverse ninja. Whatever happened to snoke's ship, that rey purloined? It'd probably have been useful on not-hoth, with rey piloting one and a team of porgs manning the guns on the falcon.

 

The not-hoth made for good cinema with the luke-kylo fight, and I liked the red dirt standing in for blood splashes. What are the odds that a randomly selected planet in the galaxy with salt-flat type areas on it is covered in sodium chloride, and not some other highly toxic salt? The rebel trooper tasting it was needed, otherwise people would just assume hoth again - there was a lot of other bits of the film that could have done with more exposition like this. Like the rebel trooper walks into the seaweed vagina: "It's an evil mirror! The jedi put this next to their sacred books as a metaphor for the folly of man"

 

BB-8 is getting ridiculous. Turns out chickenwalkers have nothing in the box on top, except for the crew? No real engine, it's all in the legs? The resistor thingy at the start was dumb, and tying up the guards was also dumb. R2 carrying luke's lightsaber for him was great, because it was unexpected - a BB-8 battlebot edition would give a droideka a run for its money. Also, if the hacker was paid by the empire, what was up with the BB-8 with the monobrow?

 

I didn't mind the character development - the HR lady was just trying to save the resistance (and had probably gone mad from the pressure), yoda was still original series yoda, luke is an Angsty Teen who has had his lack of caution bit him in the ass. Fighter jock made sense, I can understand him going for a mutiny in that situation. Rose also probably went mad from the stress, since she ruined the resistance's only shot at stopping grond for no good reason (Can't have a main character die, but extras dropping at an exponential rate is fine)

 

As a star wars film, it's a waste of the IP. I'll probably watch the sequel once it hits my student union's cinema (i.e. is cheap), but I have little desire to watch the film again.

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