StuG III Thread (and also other German vehicles I guess)

[Collimatrix]

 

 

 

Note the cameo of the T-72. Also a nice display of how tall 8x8 APCs are compared to MBTs or tracked IFVs.

 

More height difference between a wheeled APC and a tracked one than a tracked APC and a tracked MBT.

 

This shows pretty well how unrealistic the idea that APCs could be made as survivable as tanks and still have a reasonable weight is.

[Mighty_Zuk]

More height difference between a wheeled APC and a tracked one than a tracked APC and a tracked MBT.

 

This shows pretty well how unrealistic the idea that APCs could be made as survivable as tanks and still have a reasonable weight is.

I don't think anyone ever intended to create a wheeled APC as armored as a tank. Nor ever claimed to.

 

Wheeled APCs are rather tall because of their focus on belly protection, which is superior to that of tracked platforms. And because they're not expected to fight in the same places as tracked vehicles, they can be made larger and thus more spacious. 

[Xoon]

I don't think anyone ever intended to create a wheeled APC as armored as a tank. Nor ever claimed to.

 

Wheeled APCs are rather tall because of their focus on belly protection, which is superior to that of tracked platforms. And because they're not expected to fight in the same places as tracked vehicles, they can be made larger and thus more spacious. 

Actually, I am pretty sure the reason why wheeled APCs can sport better belly protection is because of their drivetrain.  Since a 8x8 requires a driveshaft going to each wheel, this makes the vehicle taller. In a tracked vehicle the tank only requires the two sprockets.  

 

Just a example:

 

 

And since it is relatively thin it makes it easy to have a V-shaped belly on wheeled APCs. 

Notice how the suspension elements are at the bottom of the belly:

 

A tracked vehicle which is completely flat on the bottom however would just get higher and higher, the more of an angle you add to the belly armor and the thicker you made it.

 

 

 

 

For comparison here is the SEP-W and SEP-T:

[Collimatrix]

That's what I thought too.  The big drivetrain is taking up a bunch of room on the center of the floor anyway, so it's not that much more added height to make the hull bottom V-shaped.  Ditching the mine-resistant hull shape wouldn't make the wheeled APC that much shorter.

[SH_MM]

I don't think anyone ever intended to create a wheeled APC as armored as a tank. Nor ever claimed to.

 

Wheeled APCs are rather tall because of their focus on belly protection, which is superior to that of tracked platforms. And because they're not expected to fight in the same places as tracked vehicles, they can be made larger and thus more spacious.

 

The belly protection of the Boxer is not superior to that of the Puma or Leopard 2A7. This is simply a false statement. The Stryker, LAV and Piranha vehicles - even in the original configurations without any sort of belly protection - are still taller than a Leopard 2 or Abrams.

 

The Boxer is not really taller than a baseline Stryker vehicle (without mine protection). The size of wheeled APCs is the results of trying to get equal levels of mobility compared to a tracked plattform, while at the same time providing greater payload capacity.

 

[LoooSeR]

Keiler

[Bronezhilet]

Lets do another guessing game:

 

 

 

 

[Bronezhilet]

Armour on Boxer with infantry module (iirc)

 

Side:

Metal-Rubber-Metal-Air-Metal-?

 

Side+top:

 

Shitty picture of spacers in side armour:

 

Frontal armour has spaced armour as well:

 

Side armour of main body versus side armour of module:

[Priory_of_Sion]

105 mm armed Marder being shown off in Indonesia

 

Notes:

• They're calling it a "medium tank"
• It has an Italian OTO Melara turret 

[DogDodger]

Lets do another guessing game:

VT 1-2?

[Walter_Sobchak]

 

105 mm armed Marder being shown off in Indonesia

 

Notes:

• They're calling it a "medium tank"
• It has an Italian OTO Melara turret 

 

So basically they re-invented the TAM tank?

[Priory_of_Sion]

TAM looks better though

[LoooSeR]

Leo 2RI

[SH_MM]

Armour on Boxer with infantry module (iirc)

 

 

Metal-Rubber-Metal-Air-Metal-?

 

Ceramic module with backing ontop of armor steel, which is connected to the Boxer's hull (made using the thin metal bending technology already mentioned in the Puma armor post earlier).

 

105 mm armed Marder being shown off in Indonesia

 

Notes:

• They're calling it a "medium tank"
• It has an Italian OTO Melara turret 

It's the second version of the Marder Medium Tank. There already was the Marder medium tank from 2012, which is fitted with AMAP armor and uses the older Hitfact 1 turret (the version above uses the newer Hitfact 2 turret). The medium tank above was created for the Indonesian Army, which is operating ex-German Marder 1A3 IFVs and is looking for a new light tank. It is competing against the vehicle made by FNSS and PT Pindad.

 

"Marder Medium MBT" at Eurosatory 2012.

 

Also, aside of the TAM and it's superior German export version, there also is the Marder DF 105 with French AMX-13 105 mm turret:

 

Not to forget the VTS-1 testbed:

 

The only real tank based on a chassis related to the Marder is however the RU 251.

[Bronezhilet]

Speaking of the VTS-1

[Bronezhilet]

Boxer driver station

[EnsignExpendable]

360 degree view of the inside of a Tiger II

[LoooSeR]

SAA soldier, somewhere in Syria

[LoooSeR]

[Collimatrix]

See?  That's what happens when you design a tank that heavy; it just sinks into the ground.

[LoooSeR]

Syrian Pz4s

 

 

[LoooSeR]

[LoooSeR]

[Collimatrix]

Ha!  That's not how you put that together!

[EnsignExpendable]

Instructions unclear, casemate upside down.