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The Small Arms Thread, Part 8: 2018; ICSR to be replaced by US Army with interim 15mm Revolver Cannon.


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Let's all take a trip back to the late 1970s and early 1980s.  This was the time of punk.  This was the time of despair.   Punk was all about minimalism; strip everything down to a few chords, wear

Stechkin's Abakan (TKB-0146). https://www.kalashnikov.ru/abakan-stechkina-avtomat-stechkina-tkb-0146/        Bullpup, system of "recoil impulse shifted in time", 2-stage

So what, my 5.56 rounds are groundbreaking too if I shoot the dirt.

4 hours ago, Toimisto said:

Whats the advantage of AR-18 style guide rods instead of guide rails? Do they wear less or something. Trying to think if AR-18 could function with 2 rails instead of 2 guiderods.

 

When an AR-18 is closed up, the two guide rods fit snugly into holes in the trunnion:

kjtCFmf.png
 

And the trunnions are connected at the back, since they are both welded to a common plate.

This means that the movement of the bolt carrier is controlled by the rods, and the rods are hooked into the trunnion at the front and to the plate at the back.  The position and timing of moving parts in the AR-18 is almost completely unaffected by the receiver.  Only the fire control group and magazine rely on the receiver being well-toleranced.

 

Now, according to this book, the sales strategy for the AR-18 was that the trunnion, barrel, and a few other high-precision machined parts would be made in the US or UK, while various other countries could buy a license to manufacture the rifle and would make the other parts.

 

Reading in-between the lines, this was a way to concentrate the important tolerances and quality control into a few parts of the rifle; namely all the parts that would be made in first world countries.

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8 hours ago, Oedipus Wreckx-n-Effect said:

I think the overall gist is that he thinks that the WWII BAR was somehow an improvement over the original.

 

Like that great bipod it came with.

I'd be tempted tom instead, point out the rate reducer, and all it's associated issues.  (It was a dumb idea).

7 hours ago, Sturgeon said:

 

Such a great bipod that virtually no actual combat photos show it in use. 

The instant it went from being a "machine rifle" to a half-assed LMG, shit was going pear shaped. 

The USMC had something promising with the cut down ones they messed with in the 20's, whereupon it's potential was promptly ignored.

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15 hours ago, Toimisto said:

Whats the advantage of AR-18 style guide rods instead of guide rails? Do they wear less or something. Trying to think if AR-18 could function with 2 rails instead of 2 guiderods.

 

In addition to what Collimatrix said, it's worth noting that correctly indexing guide rails is a giant sonnovabitch and requires a lot of skill and technical know how. Guide rods... Not so much (though RSAF Enfield still managed to fuck it up!).

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3 hours ago, Sturgeon said:

 

In addition to what Collimatrix said, it's worth noting that correctly indexing guide rails is a giant sonnovabitch and requires a lot of skill and technical know how. Guide rods... Not so much (though RSAF Enfield still managed to fuck it up!).

Nothing is more telling than looking at a tablefull of AR18's and AR180's, and noting the differences.

 

Buy an (original) Armalite for collecting, a Howa for shooting, and a Sterling for parts..

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5 hours ago, Meplat said:

Nothing is more telling than looking at a tablefull of AR18's and AR180's, and noting the differences.

 

Buy an (original) Armalite for collecting, a Howa for shooting, and a Sterling for parts..


I caught a 1971 International Defense Review on eBay the other week.  It confirmed the Lockheed connection for International sales.  They would also supply the tooling and setup, while ArmaLite would handle QC.  Another interesting comment was that Mauser was looking at buying a license for it.

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On 5/14/2018 at 4:21 PM, D.E. Watters said:


I caught a 1971 International Defense Review on eBay the other week.  It confirmed the Lockheed connection for International sales.  They would also supply the tooling and setup, while ArmaLite would handle QC.  Another interesting comment was that Mauser was looking at buying a license for it.

It was a very promising design, sad it's kind of forgotten now.

The stock was interesting in that you could loosen the single stock screw, pull out the rubber buttpad, then rotate it a quarter-turn (90 degrees) and stow a ziploc baggie with all kinds of spares in there.

It was not foam-filled like the AR-15.

 

The magazines are (were) a stumbling point for some people, but it was absurdly easy to convert an AR-15 mag to work, if one had any semblance of mechanical aptitude.

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