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Post Election Thread: Democracy Dies In Darkness And You Can Help

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Belesarius Newbie

Belesarius

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5 minutes ago, Donward said:

What I don't understand is that during the election all the conventional wisdom was that Trump NEEDED to get this guy on board because Manafort is a steady hand, and a pro at campaigns, and had this big Rolodex of contacts for fundraising, and that he was going to keep Trump "on script". The mainstream media was saying it, political pundits were saying it. 

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/20/us/politics/paul-manafort-resigns-donald-trump.html

 

 

Washington is incestuous at best. Everyone knows everyone and deals are made that are illegal as fuck every day. Once you reach a certain level of money and power it's all the same fucking social circle, no matter what your party affiliation. Trump's daughter apparently knows Chelsea very well. It's the same idea that people in Hollywood didn't know about the Weinstien thing. Open secrets that are just not talked about openly because there are consequences.

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This is just too funny not to share:

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Forwarding "We will fight until the last American" as the new NATO motto.

Donward Newbie

Donward

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3 minutes ago, Belesarius said:

Washington is incestuous at best. Everyone knows everyone and deals are made that are illegal as fuck every day. Once you reach a certain level of money and power it's all the same fucking social circle, no matter what your party affiliation. Trump's daughter apparently knows Chelsea very well. It's the same idea that people in Hollywood didn't know about the Weinstien thing. Open secrets that are just not talked about openly because there are consequences.

At any rate, this indictment is pretty weak sauce, particularly if #NEVERTRUmP and #Resistance thinks that by indicting a GOP establishment guy like manafort is going to matter a whit. 

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Belesarius Newbie

Belesarius

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1 minute ago, Donward said:

At any rate, this indictment is pretty weak sauce, particularly if #NEVERTRUmP and #Resistance thinks that by indicting a GOP establishment guy like manafort is going to matter a whit. 

Agreed 100%.  anyone who thinks this is going anywhere is at least a bit silly.

 

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Donward Newbie

Donward

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5 minutes ago, Belesarius said:

Agreed 100%.  anyone who thinks this is going anywhere is at least a bit silly.

 

Anywhere towards getting Trump at any rate. Honestly I think manafort is kinda screwed here. I would be very, VERY surprised if Trump pulled out a pen from the Pardon coffee mug sitting on his desk in the Oval Office in order to save manafort's bacon like Trump did for "Sheriff Joe" Arpaio for instance.  Conservatives - and Trump supporters - LOVED Sheriff Joe. I don't think there is anyone who gives a tinker's damn about Paul manafort and whether he is free, indicted, or spends the rest of his life in Leavenworth. 

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Ulric Newbie

Ulric

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25 minutes ago, Belesarius said:

Politicians aren't people, and they don't surround themselves with the best of the best.  Trump is a corrupt fuck.  Theres bound to be something to pin on him, if you dig deep enough. This is as much of a witch hunt as the Republicans going after Slick Willy back in the day. Anyone who is surprised that some sort of law was broken by a politician who managed to get to the top is delusional or overly partisan.

In the US, people unknowingly commit three felonies a day. You could arrest and prosecute anyone at anytime if you dig deep enough. The issue that a lot of people are having is that this investigation is being used to go after political enemies and a sitting president in what basically amounts to a soft coup. It has nothing to do with seeking justice for the aggrieved. There is a much more serious issue that needs to be looked into, but is being ignored. There selling of strategic materials to a foreign country after receiving over 100 million in kickbacks, the use of the IRS to go after political opponents, the "botched robbery" of a DNC staffer as he was on his way to talk to the FBI, and numerus other serious scandals far outweigh this nonexistent "Trump Russian collusion" BS that has been dominating the mainstream media for the past year.

 

Oh yeah, I almost forgot the part where the state department "lost track of" 6 billion dollars under Hillary Clinton's watch, but nobody is interested in looking into that. I'm sure that Trump had plenty of slimy deals in his past, but that is all in the private sector and not related to his presidency as far as we know.

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Ramlaen Advanced Member

Ramlaen

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43 minutes ago, Donward said:

What I don't understand is that during the election all the conventional wisdom was that Trump NEEDED to get this guy on board because Manafort is a steady hand, and a pro at campaigns, and had this big Rolodex of contacts for fundraising, and that he was going to keep Trump "on script". The mainstream media was saying it, political pundits were saying it. 

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/20/us/politics/paul-manafort-resigns-donald-trump.html

 

 

 

What if the script was to set Trump up as ‘colluding with Russia’?

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Sturgeon Advanced Member

Sturgeon

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1 hour ago, Belesarius said:

Politicians aren't people, and they don't surround themselves with the best of the best.  Trump is a corrupt fuck.  Theres bound to be something to pin on him, if you dig deep enough. This is as much of a witch hunt as the Republicans going after Slick Willy back in the day. Anyone who is surprised that some sort of law was broken by a politician who managed to get to the top is delusional or overly partisan.

 

By the standards of politicians, businessmen are saints. They have far fewer strings they can pull to save their asses, generally speaking, and the risks of screwing up are higher. And Trump was, until late 2015, a businessman.


Doesn't mean there's nothing in his closet, but if you start opening all the closets on Capitol Hill thinking you're gonna nail him for something, my bet is you'll fuck everyone but him over first and harder.

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Sgt.Squarehead Newbie

Sgt.Squarehead

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The Russia thing just exploded:  http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-mueller-indictments-manafort-rick-gates-white-house-drama-a8028396.html

 

Manafort, Gates & Papadopoulos indicted.  :o

 

Going back to an earlier thought.....It seems that October surprises don't only arrive in election years after all!   ;) 

 

Interesting Times.  :mellow:

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ApplesauceBandit Newbie

ApplesauceBandit

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17 minutes ago, Lostwingman said:

 

It's practically masturbation on my fb feed...

And the best part is that I feel like you wouldn't really find any Trump fans who actually cared about Manafort in the first place. 

 

It's like a few months back whenever that one thing happened when there was this one scandal thing with Kushner.  The #resist crowd was feeling like the Trumplets were BTFO despite a lot of Trump fans not wanting Kushner there in the first place.

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Donward Newbie

Donward

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1 hour ago, ApplesauceBandit said:

And the best part is that I feel like you wouldn't really find any Trump fans who actually cared about Manafort in the first place. 

 

It's like a few months back whenever that one thing happened when there was this one scandal thing with Kushner.  The #resist crowd was feeling like the Trumplets were BTFO despite a lot of Trump fans not wanting Kushner there in the first place.

Pretty much. Manafort was an Establishment carpetbagger that was basically foisted onto the Trump campaign by the RNC.

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Ramlaen Advanced Member

Ramlaen

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2 hours ago, Lostwingman said:

 

It's practically masturbation on my fb feed...

 

2 hours ago, ApplesauceBandit said:

And the best part is that I feel like you wouldn't really find any Trump fans who actually cared about Manafort in the first place. 

 

It's like a few months back whenever that one thing happened when there was this one scandal thing with Kushner.  The #resist crowd was feeling like the Trumplets were BTFO despite a lot of Trump fans not wanting Kushner there in the first place.

 

58 minutes ago, Donward said:

Pretty much. Manafort was an Establishment carpetbagger that was basically foisted onto the Trump campaign by the RNC.

 

My favorite part isn't how Manafort got indicted on something that has nothing to do with Trump, it's how something that started as an attempt to discredit leaked DNC emails has boomeranged back as a giant web of shit.

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Sturgeon Advanced Member

Sturgeon

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This headline seems like fake news to me. I liked this part:

 

Quote

Stretch, in his prepared testimony, seeks to play down the significance of that level of exposure to content from Russian-backed accounts.

“Our best estimate is that approximately 126 million people may have been served one of their stories at some point during the two-year period,” Stretch says in prepared testimony. “This equals about four-thousandths of one percent (0.004%) of content in News Feed, or approximately 1 out of 23,000 pieces of content.”

The person familiar with the issue said: “Put another way, if each of these posts were a commercial on television, you'd have to watch more than 600 hours of television to see something from” the Russia-backed posts.

 

"Play down" seems more like "put in context" to me.

Professor David Karpf speaks true:

 

Quote

“It is a problem in that this is evidence that foreign nationals actively attempted to impact our election and they did manage to reach 126 million with messages,” Karpf said. “It’s going to be important for Facebook and Google and Twitter to get a handle on this stuff before the next election, hopefully with the help from our regulators, but what we should avoid is thinking, ‘Wow, 126 million people were duped into voting for Trump.’”

 

The thing about the Internet is that's it's international. So I am not sure what's scandalous about this, that's business as usual. I don't think you can prevent it.

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ApplesauceBandit Newbie

ApplesauceBandit

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I just want to save my complaining for when I can actually look at the bill myself, not rely on some person telling me what's totally in it.  Of course the people who don't like Trump are going to find a way to say it's bad, but has there even been any proper releases of what's planned to be in it yet? 

Like @Sturgeon says, tax cuts for the uber rich and increases for the people lower down seems to be way I hear any form of planned tax change described anyways.  For all I know, it could be a decrease on the absurdly high corporate tax rate and some sort of shrinking to the welfare system, would still technically fit the go-to description.  That would fit better with what Trump's been saying forever than what that meme is claiming.

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Belesarius Newbie

Belesarius

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36 minutes ago, ApplesauceBandit said:

I just want to save my complaining for when I can actually look at the bill myself, not rely on some person telling me what's totally in it.  Of course the people who don't like Trump are going to find a way to say it's bad, but has there even been any proper releases of what's planned to be in it yet? 

Like @Sturgeon says, tax cuts for the uber rich and increases for the people lower down seems to be way I hear any form of planned tax change described anyways.  For all I know, it could be a decrease on the absurdly high corporate tax rate and some sort of shrinking to the welfare system, would still technically fit the go-to description.  That would fit better with what Trump's been saying forever than what that meme is claiming.

The numbers I've seen don't look good. and anyone thinking that He won't line his own pockets while fleecing everyone else hasn't looked at a typical Trump business plan. But if you can show me something where the middle and lower classes do better under Trump I'll be glad to eat crow.

 

PS: If it's 'trickle down' it doesn't fucking work.

 

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