politics Post Election Thread: Democracy Dies In Darkness And You Can Help

[Donward]

On 5/30/2018 at 6:53 AM, Ramlaen said:

When you see it...

 

 

*Claps*

[Sturgeon]

Not sure I get it.

[Donward]

2 minutes ago, Sturgeon said:

Not sure I get it.

I think he thinks it looks like JEB! Bush... Not sure. Not drunk enough to confirm.

[Sturgeon]

He kinda looks like Jeb, but not that much.

[Donward]

5 minutes ago, Sturgeon said:

He kinda looks like Jeb, but not that much.

I had to squint too. I guess we need to ask @Ramlaen

[Ramlaen]

1 hour ago, Sturgeon said:

Not sure I get it.

 

The visual of what Acosta was complaining about while calling a guy wearing a you are fake news shirt a nice guy.

 

Also this;

 

[Sturgeon]

See that was what I originally thought, but "clap" from Don threw me off lol.

[Sturgeon]

also, media be thirsty

[Collimatrix]

8 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said:

Could you quantify that for me? 

 

It's quite difficult to grasp the US perspective on all this for me as an outsider.

 

 

 

You know that saying about how Waterloo was won on the fields of Eton?  Subtly implying that everyone making decisions during the battle had been rubbing elbows since around the time their balls dropped? US politics are like that too, at least at a national level. It's mega-incest.

 

Barack Obama went to Harvard. George W. Bush went to Yale *and* Harvard.  Bill Clinton went to Yale. George H. W. Bush went to Yale. Trump went to the University of Pennsylvania, which is still an Ivy, but it's a clue that Trump maybe doesn't see himself as quite the same tribe as the rest of these people. 

 

Then there is the way he talks. I think you Brits have entire four year degree programs devoted to the study of the relationship between social class and regional accent. In the US it's a little simpler. Any sort of regional accent is gauche. Anyone who is anyone will usually try to mask their regional accent, or at the very least speak in a certain *way* about certain *things.*

 

This may seem stupid to seize upon, but it's very informative. People imitate the accents of their friends, that's how the things reproduce, after all. So if Trump still speaks with a low to middle class New York accent and with low to middle class New York mannerisms, that is a clue as to whom he considers his friends. Trump is not trying to fit in to Washington and make friends there.

 

Trump is an outsider, and previously you had two sorts of outsiders in US Federal politics.  You had the sellouts, who compromised in order to get traction, and ended up the same as anyone else.  Joe Scarborough wrote a pretty good book on the massive bureaucracy that has perfected the art of breaking and taming politicians, but there are many other accounts. That's basically the plot of Yes Minister. Every once in a while there would be a politician who proved insoluble to this process. They would be the Ron Pauls and suchlike. They stuck to their principles, and thus never achieved anything. Admirable, perhaps, but totally harmless to the machine. 

 

Trump is anything but harmless. It was recently announced that the Federal government slashed 24,000 jobs under Trump. That is simultaneously tiny and huge. For the president to win *at all* against the bureaucracy is a reversal of one hundred and thirty years of legal and informal precedent. Even if the material effects are small, people will notice. 

 

It's like the Japanese smashing the tsarist fleet at Tsiushima.  The actual immediate implications of Japan beating Russia in a war were modest, in a global sense. But all around the world people under the rule of European colonial administration suddenly realized that white men bleed too. 

[Donward]

8 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said:

 

But how do you guys feel about the man himself.....I'd kinda feel safer if it had been Bernie. 

 

 

 

I think one of the personality traits about Trump that is widely overlooked and not reported is that he is an unabashed patriot. And not in the way academics or bureaucrats feel they're the guardians of the keys of wisdom because they went to the right schools. I'm talking men standing around the 1967 mustang, tinkering with the carburetor, listening to the ballgame, while hotdogs are cooking on the barbecue kind of patriotism. It's the sort of patriotism where steelworkers and pipe-fitters put a sticker of an American flag on the hardhat they wear at work each day. I'm talking the kind of patriotism they used to teach in elementary schools where you stand up every morning to say the Pledge of Allegiance. It's the type of patriotism Trump's grandfather must have felt when he saw the Statue of Liberty for the first time immigrating (legally) from the shithole that was - and is - Europe on his way to the land of opportunity. It's the type of patriotism where Trump was unironically singing along with Lee Greenwood's "Proud to be and American" on Inauguration Day.

 

It's not intellectual. It's an emotional bond to his country. 

 

Hillary Clinton was not a patriot. Neither was Barack Obama. And I don't say that as a knuckle-scraping Republican. It's just that it's blatantly obvious that the previous Administration saw themselves as global citizens, ushering mankind away from the idea of nation states to a Utopian future with no borders. 

 

Trump is against all of that. As a patriot, he wants to put America first. It was part of his campaign you know. Now Trump is happy to work with other countries of the world, but it is under the auspices that we're the foreman of the construction crew. And this isn't some new phenomenon. For over two centuries, America's guiding principle was that we would be the leading player on the world stage, the "Shining City on the Hill". This was a bi-partisan idea. Harry Truman and Calvin Coolidge would both recognize the spirit that motivates the current Administration and support it. Hell, JFK and Eisenhower would and certainly Reagan. The issue is that we've had four Administrations since the end of the Cold War that have been aberrations to the notion of Americanism and unapologetic patriotism. Bush Sr, Clinton, Bush Jr, and Obama seemed more focused on creating a post-American society where this country was no better than Portugal or Bangladesh or Zimbabwe. 

 

Couple this with what @Collimatrix has described about how Trump portrays himself to the world, identifying with working class people. Throw in the fact that Trump has four decades of executive experience running a multi-billion dollar corporation with 22,500 employees spread across the US and the World. Add his natural charisma and showmanship and you have a US President who is a patriotic Chief Executive who is confident in his own skin when dealing with actors on the domestic and foreign stage but who has empathy for the little guy.

 

Contrast this with the Obama Administration rich was run like a faculty lounge filled with Ivy League academics who view the world through a policy paper. Worse, foreign leaders regarded them the same way.

 

Contrast this with either of the Bush Administrations who ran the White House like a CIA spook house/ think tank.

 

Or the Clinton's who ran the White House like a Southern politician who was out to line his own pockets but who also felt your pain. 

[Donward]

Also, more reasons why the mainstream media doesn't get it and why they're held in such low esteem.

 

Trump tweets this which was a precursor to good news about the job market and low unemployment numbers, including record low minority unemployment numbers.

 

 

Which leads to the media collectively shitting itself.

 

The Outrage Over Trump's market shaking Tweet via The Atlantic

 

Trump breaks protocol and jolts markets by teasing secret jobs numbers via Politico

 

How the government keeps its Economic data secret from leakers -- like the President via Politico

 

Trump leaked sensitive info from may jobs report. And that's a big effing problem via HuffPo

 

And it's still the top story at the Washington Post.

 

And so forth.

 

It's almost predictable the faux outrage expressed by the media everytime the President sends a Tweet. You'd think that the media would eventually wise up and stop taking the bait.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Walter_Sobchak]

6 hours ago, Donward said:

Also, more reasons why the mainstream media doesn't get it and why they're held in such low esteem.

 

Trump tweets this which was a precursor to good news about the job market and low unemployment numbers, including record low minority unemployment numbers.

 

 

Which leads to the media collectively shitting itself.

 

The Outrage Over Trump's market shaking Tweet via The Atlantic

 

Trump breaks protocol and jolts markets by teasing secret jobs numbers via Politico

 

How the government keeps its Economic data secret from leakers -- like the President via Politico

 

Trump leaked sensitive info from may jobs report. And that's a big effing problem via HuffPo

 

And it's still the top story at the Washington Post.

 

And so forth.

 

It's almost predictable the faux outrage expressed by the media everytime the President sends a Tweet. You'd think that the media would eventually wise up and stop taking the bait.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's not faux outrage.  It's a federal rule that bars employees of the executive branch from commenting on leading economic indicators, including the monthly jobs report, until an hour after they are released.  Why should Trump be above the law?

[Walter_Sobchak]

So, we all excited for a trade war with Canada?

[Walter_Sobchak]

7 hours ago, Donward said:

 

 

 

Trump is against all of that. As a patriot, he wants to put America first. It was part of his campaign you know. Now Trump is happy to work with other countries of the world, but it is under the auspices that we're the foreman of the construction crew. And this isn't some new phenomenon. For over two centuries, America's guiding principle was that we would be the leading player on the world stage, the "Shining City on the Hill". This was a bi-partisan idea. Harry Truman and Calvin Coolidge would both recognize the spirit that motivates the current Administration and support it. Hell, JFK and Eisenhower would and certainly Reagan. The issue is that we've had four Administrations since the end of the Cold War that have been aberrations to the notion of Americanism and unapologetic patriotism. Bush Sr, Clinton, Bush Jr, and Obama seemed more focused on creating a post-American society where this country was no better than Portugal or Bangladesh or Zimbabwe. 

 

 

 

I don't even know where to begin with this paragraph.  Bush Jr. was most certainly a patriot in the traditional sense of the word.  He was the last president we had who actually served in the US Military in a war.  

 

Your dividing line is awfully convenient for your own pro-trump stance.  You claim that the last four presidents are un-patriotic or unamerican or something.  I suspect that this has less to do with anything their administrations actually did, but rather because all of them have voiced their dislike for Trump.  Then you claim, without a shred of evidence, that all the dead presidents are awesome patriots and would surely support Trump.  Obviously, this is not a provable statement, since these men are all dead.  

 

It's a bit like Trump claiming all dead US servicemen would be happy he is president.  

 

Most people consider putting words into the mouths of dead people to be disrespectful.  

 

 

[Belesarius]

4 minutes ago, Walter_Sobchak said:

So, we all excited for a trade war with Canada?

Our aluminum producers will be laughing all the way to the bank. Some of the stuff we make, y'all don't.  And it's shit you need for the defence industry. So our aluminum industry is just going to laugh and up the price, and make more $.  Steel industry might take a minor hit.

 

[Donward]

8 minutes ago, Walter_Sobchak said:

 

Yes, he is the kind of Patriot that makes Memorial day tweets about how dead US soldiers would be very happy about his presidency if only they were alive.  Patriotic indeed.

 

 

Walt hates everything about Trump, even the way he walks, and chews his food, and the thing he does with his fingers when he speaks.

 

News at 11.

[Donward]

53 minutes ago, Walter_Sobchak said:

 

It's not faux outrage.  It's a federal rule that bars employees of the executive branch from commenting on leading economic indicators, including the monthly jobs report, until an hour after they are released.  Why should Trump be above the law?

It's faux outrage and the President can declassify anything he wants. And the only ones upset about Trump's innocuous Tweet - that he looks forward to seeing the unemployment numbers this morning - are the media and people who hate Trump no matter what who are unable to argue the fact that the jobs forecast looks pretty good under this Administration. Oh, and the vultures on Wall Street who lost money shorting the American economy yesterday. 

 

But at this point, Trump haters have nothing but petulant hate on their side. And this hatred has gotten so ridiculous and petty and tactless, that a couple days ago the entire US media collectively shat down their legs because Ivanka Trump tweeted a picture holding her son.

 

 

OUTRAGE!!!!!

 

http://time.com/5292914/ivanka-trump-twitter-immigrant-child-separation/

 

http://www.newsweek.com/ivanka-trump-photo-son-labeled-tone-deaf-us-border-agents-separate-children-946227

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/video/wonder/ivanka-trump-slammed-after-posting-tone-deaf-photo-with-her-son/vp-AAxVKXm

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/may/27/ivanka-trump-tweets-photo-backlash-border-separation-policy

 

And so forth. Every major US media entity ran with a variant on this story.

 

I don't even know what to do with the American Left when as a collective whole, from professors to Democratic strategists to Hollywood celebrities, it lacks the emotional intelligence to not be-clown itself over a Tweet of the President's daughter holding her son. I don't know how to treat the "loyal opposition" in our Republic when they lack common decency to not act like complete twats over that photo.

[Walter_Sobchak]

25 minutes ago, Donward said:

It's faux outrage and the President can declassify anything he wants. And the only ones upset about Trump's innocuous Tweet - that he looks forward to seeing the unemployment numbers this morning - are the media and people who hate Trump no matter what who are unable to argue the fact that the jobs forecast looks pretty good under this Administration. Oh, and the vultures on Wall Street who lost money shorting the American economy yesterday. 

 

But at this point, Trump haters have nothing but petulant hate on their side. And this hatred has gotten so ridiculous and petty and tactless, that a couple days ago the entire US media collectively shat down their legs because Ivanka Trump tweeted a picture holding her son.

 

 

OUTRAGE!!!!!

 

http://time.com/5292914/ivanka-trump-twitter-immigrant-child-separation/

 

http://www.newsweek.com/ivanka-trump-photo-son-labeled-tone-deaf-us-border-agents-separate-children-946227

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/video/wonder/ivanka-trump-slammed-after-posting-tone-deaf-photo-with-her-son/vp-AAxVKXm

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/may/27/ivanka-trump-tweets-photo-backlash-border-separation-policy

 

And so forth. Every major US media entity ran with a variant on this story.

 

I don't even know what to do with the American Left when as a collective whole, from professors to Democratic strategists to Hollywood celebrities, it lacks the emotional intelligence to not be-clown itself over a Tweet of the President's daughter holding her son. I don't know how to treat the "loyal opposition" in our Republic when they lack common decency to not act like complete twats over that photo.

 

Now you know how many on the left felt when we had to endure 8 years of Fox news and their ilk making up bullshit controversies over innocuous things that Obama supposedly did.  Remember the scandal of the light brown suit?  Or how about the time he put Dijon mustard on his burger? Or the dreaded terrorist fist jab?  Or the time he introduced a Jobs Act that was held together by (gasp!) a binder clip?  Or when Michelle went sleeveless?  Don't act all shocked and surprised when all of a sudden the "media" start picking on the president you happen to like for silly and stupid shit.  I doubt you were complaining when they did it to the president you didn't like.  

 

 

[Donward]

13 minutes ago, Walter_Sobchak said:

 

Now you know how many on the left felt when we had to endure 8 years of Fox news and their ilk making up bullshit controversies over innocuous things that Obama supposedly did.  Remember the scandal of the light brown suit?  Or how about the time he put Dijon mustard on his burger? Or the dreaded terrorist fist jab?  Or the time he introduced a Jobs Act that was held together by (gasp!) a binder clip?  Or when Michelle went sleeveless?  Don't act all shocked and surprised when all of a sudden the "media" start picking on the president you happen to like for silly and stupid shit.  I doubt you were complaining when they did it to the president you didn't like.  

 

 

No. Actually I don't remember light brown suit. Or Dijon mustard. Or most of the bullshit you mentioned that was no doubt ignored by 98 percent of the media. But then again, I don't watch Fox News and my life isn't centered around petty-tit-for-tat, what-about bullshit. So yes, color me surprised that frauds and phonies like Glenn Beck and Bill O'Reilly and Sean Hannity beclowned themselves.

 

 

 

 

[Collimatrix]

1 hour ago, Walter_Sobchak said:

So, we all excited for a trade war with Canada?

 

It's a pretty exceptional trade war that lasts more than a few months.  Someone will blink and a new compromise will be drawn up.

[Sturgeon]

5 hours ago, Walter_Sobchak said:

Your dividing line is awfully convenient for your own pro-trump stance.  You claim that the last four presidents are un-patriotic or unamerican or something.

 

He was very explicit about not saying that, Walt.

[Sturgeon]

3 hours ago, Collimatrix said:

 

It's a pretty exceptional trade war that lasts more than a few months.  Someone will blink and a new compromise will be drawn up.

 

Which we desperately need. It's almost like a trade war is the point.

[Sturgeon]

I will say that I don't think Don's right about Bush being a globalist, but it doesn't matter because Bush basically was pushed around by his advisers, most of whom clearly were.

Clinton probably wasn't either - but we certainly don't need any more of the classical Southern politician, either.

Obama and Bush 1.0, I think they qualify as globalists (of different stripes), certainly.

[Oedipus Wreckx-n-Effect]

Just saw a bumper sticker. It said, "my dog is a democrat."

 

Damn, who won't the Dems register to vote? First illegals, then dead people, now pets?

[Donward]

Speaking of patriotism...

 

Artist Jon McNaughton has his latest Trump themed artwork available.

 

 

And some works from his collection.

 

 

The logical end of the 2-year Mueller investigation concludes with President Trump roughing up the special prosecutor on floor of the Capitol.

 

 

"You know when I was your age, I went out to fishing with all my brothers and my father, and everybody. And I was, I was the only one who caught a fish. Nobody else could catch one except me. You know how I did it? Every time I put the line in the water I said a Hail Mary and every time I said a Hail Mary I caught a fish. You believe that? It's true, that's the secret. You wanna try it when we go out on the lake?"

 

 

"I said DON'T tread on mrhmph!!!"

 

Or...

 

"Where's William Howard Taft?"