Active Protection System (APS) for tanks

[LoooSeR]

   RPG rocket that was hit by Arena but did not detonated.

 

   Assymetrical placement of radars - left ones are near gunner sight, right ones are mounted on top of turret "cheek". Also, rear storage box is now fully occupied by Arena subsystems, so strage boxes on the side were added.

[LoooSeR]

   Stolen from otvaga, tankoff did a summary post on Arena systems.

 

   Arena (1993) patent:

   1 are countermunitions in their launchers, placed around turret. 2 is radar station on top of the turret.

 

Spoiler

   Same direction can be covered by 2 or even 3 countermunitions.

 

   Arena-M APS with correctable trajectory countermunitions:

   Compared to previous version much less countermunitions and launchers are used, subsystems are more compact. Less weight, statistically less vulnerable to fragmentation damage.

 

Spoiler

 

   Countermunition schematics. CM is connected to launcher with a wire, BTW.

 

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

 

   Patent for BMP-3 equipped with Arena, pic showing possible use of APS as a system to automatically turn turret of AFV in the direction from which AFV was shot at.

 

   Looks like Arena was offered to Germans in 90s. Pics from Wehrtechnisches Symposium, 1995.

 

Spoiler

 

 

 

   One of first article about Arena, 1996.

 

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

   2012 - model of Arena-M (or Arena with correctable countermunitions) was shown.

 

   At RAE-2013 T-72 with shown with similar system, but with some additional changes.

 

Spoiler

 

 

   Arena-E with correctable countermunitions, video by KBM.

 

Spoiler

 

 

   Small boxes - receivers. Bigger ones - transmitters/radars. 3rd one is hardware module

 

 

50m detection range, minimal reaction time - 0.04s, same direction is covered by at least 2 countermunitions, can intercept incoming projectiles with speeds of 70 to 1000 m/s. Can work of 8 hours without stops, weight - up to 900kg.

   Laser sensors (same as on Shtora) can be part of Arena. APS can be intergrated into BMS.

 

   Countermunition launch. Small holes just under cap/cover probably are impulse jets to rotate countermunition after launch.

 

   Upper schematics proably shows those impulse jets.

 

   Launch.

 

Spoiler

   Correction phase

 

 

 

   Question if it is actually capable of intercepting top attack threats in configurations shown to public is still open. Max detection range is 50 meters, but how much radars can see "up" is question that i don't know answer for. Vertically aimed launchers suggest that at least ATGM that "overfly" target (like Bill 2 or TOW-2B) are covered by modernised system. Original Arena (at least in 1995 config) was not capable of intercepting overfly ATGMs.   

   Another question without answer is how much "correction" measures can change facing of countermunition. 

 

   Against top attack threats there were ideas to place CMs nearly horizontaly and aim them upwards.

 

[Reta]

19 hours ago, LoooSeR said:

   Question if it is actually capable of intercepting top attack threats in configurations shown to public is still open. Max detection range is 50 meters, but how much radars can see "up" is question that i don't know answer for. Vertically aimed launchers suggest that at least ATGM that "overfly" target (like Bill 2 or TOW-2B) are covered by modernised system. Original Arena (at least in 1995 config) was not capable of intercepting overfly ATGMs.   

Firstly, great post. Secondly, regarding overfly ATGMs - how high they can go relative to the tank? IIRC Those missiles carry EFP charges rather than HEAT charges and if I remeber correctly EFPs can be usually set-off at greater ranges than HEAT warheads. So if TOW-2B for example flies 1 meter higher it's probably inside the killng zone of the arena-m, But is it true for an height of 4 meters as well? That the interesting question.

Another thing is the senors, I gather both arena version use an RF senosr suite (aka radar), we know that the two prominent western APS systems which are trophy and iron fist are based on AESA radars (lately even intergrated with EO sensors). Do we know how modern Arena-M's sensor suite is? I guess there's a reason for the other systems to go as modern as they can get.

[LoooSeR]

3 hours ago, Reta said:

Secondly, regarding overfly ATGMs - how high they can go relative to the tank? 

   1-2 meters in case of Bill 2. Although it is no longer is service.

 

 

3 hours ago, Reta said:

Another thing is the senors, I gather both arena version use an RF senosr suite (aka radar), we know that the two prominent western APS systems which are trophy and iron fist are based on AESA radars (lately even intergrated with EO sensors). Do we know how modern Arena-M's sensor suite is? I guess there's a reason for the other systems to go as modern as they can get.

   They are not AESA, at least frontal ones, but i don't have exact information on radars of Arena.

 

   On early model, radar looks like had this vertical arc of detection:

   Missile with OTA could probably be detected, but unlikely to be effectively engaged or even classified as valuable target by a system.

 

   Arena-M, shown in latest episode of Military Acceptance, have at least side radars aimed slightly upwards:

   Which may indicate better coverage against OTA ATGMs, maybe even top attack ones, but this is just a guess.

[LoooSeR]

   Arena-E and Arena-M APS with build in smoke grenades launchers:

 

   Drozd-2 APS interceptor shell:

Spoiler

 

[SH_MM]

 

X-ray high-speed image of an APFSDS round after being engaged by AMAP-ADS (from a test conducted some time prior November 2013).

[Ramlaen]

 

[alanch90]

Same idea as ADS

[Alzoc]

8 hours ago, alanch90 said:

Same idea as ADS

 

Because at it's core it is the ADS.

Used to be called Shark (Système hard kill) and it's not exactly new

It is basically the ADS but with Thales built sensor and detonator.

Apart from adapting the system to the new Scorpion vehicles, I'm not sure if there is any difference with the old system (which was already presented on a VAB back in 2008)

 

https://www.defense.gouv.fr/dga/actualite-dga/2008/l-initiation-opto-pyrotechnique-une-rupture-technologique-dans-la-protection-active-des-vehicules-blindes

 

https://defense-update.com/20080701_eurosatory08_aps.html

 

[Ramlaen]

https://breakingdefense.com/2021/08/strikeshield-aps-game-changing-modular-protection-with-lower-risk-of-detection/

[Ramlaen]

 

[Ramlaen]

https://www.defensenews.com/land/2021/10/12/after-pumping-the-brakes-army-moves-to-field-iron-fist-protection-system-on-bradley/

 

The Iron Fist system has completed the majority of required testing, Brig. Gen. Glenn Dean, the program executive officer for Army ground combat systems, told Defense News in an interview before the Association of the U.S. Army’s annual expo.

“There’s a little bit left to go and then some integration work, but we’re essentially reaching the point where we’re just waiting for resources, whether Army or congressionally-provided, to proceed into procurement,” he said.

[Ramlaen]

 

[VPZ]

Quote

Israel’s Rafael Advanced Defense Systems has forged a partnership with Germany-based Krauss-Maffei Wegmann and Spain-based General Dynamics European Land Systems to help market the Trophy active protection system in Europe, the company announced.

 

https://www.defensenews.com/industry/2021/11/12/rafael-finds-european-partners-to-market-trophy-active-protection-system/

[N-L-M]

Hello,

This is an English language forum, you are requested to not post in other languages.

Also there's no need to triple post.

And I'm entirely unsure if this is or isn't a spambot

[LoooSeR]

On 1/2/2022 at 7:49 PM, N-L-M said:

Hello,

This is an English language forum, you are requested to not post in other languages.

Also there's no need to triple post.

And I'm entirely unsure if this is or isn't a spambot

That was a spambot. And it tried to make us read some Ukrainian news site.

 

Fucking Kharkovites.

[N-L-M]

Sometimes it's hard to tell spambots from certain types of live human poster.

[LoooSeR]

Stolen from Discord.

 

[LoooSeR]

Rheinmetall ASSS APS.

   Would be interesting to know details on this one, not much info online about it.

 

Some information about it is in this slide:

Spoiler

   So it can protect sides from threats at +-30 degr, uses IR laser to detect projectiles, active element is a frag cassette. Translations says it was developed against directional mines (or they meant HEAT warhead type of AT weapons?). Effective distance of interception was min 1 meter, pref. 2 meters (maybe?). Detection range is shown was 2 meters. No ability to intercept 2 or more projectiles.

[Lord_James]

1 hour ago, Guest JamesLatop said:

Active Protection System (APS) for tanks - Page 11 - Ballistics Science Discussion - Sturgeon's House
-
Гидра - официальный сайт анонимной торговой площадки, которая является самой крупной в РФ. Перейдя в Гидра магазин, вы получаете доступ ко всем товарам. И здесь каждый сможет найти для себя подходящее решение. На данный момент на площадке можно увидеть множество товаров и услуг разного направления и ее посещают люди из всех стран СНГ. При этом Hydra union не требует дополнительной установки браузера TOR и соединения через него. Площадка полностью анонимна и работает автономно. Вам достаточно только перейти по ссылке Гидра: https://xn--hydraruzxpnw4af-ic5h.com . Далее потребуется пройти простую регистрацию, и после этого получить доступ к большому каталогу магазина Hydra, в котором можно найти товары на любой вкус, независимо от ваших предпочтений. гидра магазин


[url=https://hydraruzspsnew4af.xyz]hydra зеркала
[/url]

faga76iJ-1

 

On 1/3/2022 at 12:26 PM, LoooSeR said:

That was a spambot. And it tried to make us read some Ukrainian news site.

 

Fucking Kharkovites.

Another one? 

[LoooSeR]

13 hours ago, Lord_James said:

 

Another one? 

 

 

[Lord_James]

4 hours ago, Guest burenoksom said:

Уличные тренажеры для детей купить.
Детская спортивная площадка купить.
Актуальная информация уличные спортивные комплексы на сайте.
Антивандальные спортивные тренажеры для улицы.
Купить манжеты для ног.

 

On 2/8/2022 at 12:19 PM, LoooSeR said:

 

 

Well, this is mildly concerning… 

[N-L-M]

Ok so apparently there was a bit of an oopsie in the settings which allowed guests (without registration) to not only view but also post in this subforum specifically.

Should be fixed now, so we only get the regular spambots and not this special kind.

[SH_MM]

Rheinmetall claims the Panther has a new TAPS (top attack protection system). Is it maybe based on micro-UAVs?

[Renegade334]

Army announces improved test results in light weight active protection systems | Article | The United States Army

 

 

Quote

Detroit Arsenal, Michigan – The Army recently completed rigorous testing on an active protection system that showed significantly improved results over previous tests. The Iron Fist Light Decoupled Active Protection System achieved further improved performance in recent live-fire testing on the Bradley Infantry Fighting Vehicle.

 

The testing completed in October 2022 demonstrated improvements in both durability and system effectiveness from previous testing.

 

"The Army is very pleased with the improved performance of this system," said Maj. Gen. Glenn Dean, the Army's program executive officer for Ground Combat Systems. "The software improvements since 2018 are more consistent and stable. We see continued future growth opportunities for the system, but this active protection system better protects our soldiers and vehicles on the battlefield."

 

The system tested would make the Bradley significantly more survivable against threats such as rocket propelled grenades and anti-tank guided missiles that have been demonstrated to be so lethal in Ukraine.

 

The Iron Fist system consists of optical sensors, radar, and lightweight explosive projectile interceptors that counter-launch toward an incoming airborne threat, such as a missile. The projectile explodes near the threat and away from the vehicle, deterring or defeating the threat, while minimizing explosion damage to the vehicle and the soldiers.

 

The Iron Fist system is designed to protect armored and light armored platforms. Due to its light weight, the Army potentially could equip a full range of ground combat vehicles, including upgrading legacy ground vehicle platforms previously constrained by size, weight, and power.

 

In 2016, the Army chose to test the Iron Fist Lightweight Decoupled System to protect its medium- and light-armored vehicles. Initial testing in 2018 was to validate the vendor’s (General Dynamics and Elbit Systems, Inc.) performance claims. Congress provided additional funding in fiscal year 2022, toward the goal of equipping an entire Army brigade of Bradley vehicles in 2025 with continued funding.

 

An integrated active protection system is being considered with the development of the Army’s Optionally Manned Fighting Vehicle, slated to replace the Bradley in coming years. OMFV is the U.S. Army’s first ground combat vehicle designed using modern digital engineering tools and techniques, with prototype testing expected in 2026.