Jump to content
Please support this forum by joining the SH Patreon ×
Sturgeon's House

The Leopard 2 Thread


Militarysta

Recommended Posts

  • 4 weeks later...

Leopard 2 NOR - Rheinmetall’s offer to the Norwegian Leopard 2 upgrade programme (P5050) that was cancelled a few years ago:

 

zOS2Dzu.jpg

 

It looks like a somewhat downgraded version of the ATD demonstrator (no L55A1, no ROSY etc.). In addition to the vehicle cameras from Saab, it would have had Kongsberg’s Integrated Combat Solution (ICS). Also, if you got the feeling that this image reminds you of something, it’s probably for good reason. Anyway, I guess time will tell if we made the right call on this one. If we end up with 84+ Leo 2A7V or K2, then the answer is decisively yes, but if that doesn’t happen (I mean, this is like our fourth attempt at upgrading/replacing the Leo 2A4...), then 38 of these would certainly have been way better than nothing.  

 

Speaking of the Norwegian tank replacement project, Hyundai Rotem have been pretty vocal lately about the industrial benefits of selecting the K2. They’re offering local production of all the turrets and spare parts, as well as system integration and final assembly. A South Korean purchase of Kongsberg's Naval Strike Missile is apparently also on the table. Now, while I think it’s fairly obvious why Hyundai Rotem & South Korea would be willing to offer up a lot to secure this contract, there is also a very good reason for why they are going out in the media before the competition has even started, namely that there might not even be a competition! A direct acquisition from KMW is apparently still an option, so Hyundai & MED (their Scandinavian representative) have to throw in a wrench to stop this from happening, and thus force a competition. It also seems to be working, and unless KMW can offer industrial incentives that are about as good as Hyundai’s, it seems unlikely that a direct acquisition project will be able to pass parliament approval next year.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 9/1/2020 at 11:38 AM, Laser Shark said:

A direct acquisition from KMW is apparently still an option, so Hyundai & MED (their Scandinavian representative) have to throw in a wrench to stop this from happening, and thus force a competition. It also seems to be working, and unless KMW can offer industrial incentives that are about as good as Hyundai’s, it seems unlikely that a direct acquisition project will be able to pass parliament approval next year.

 

I wonder if the U212CD submarines will affect KMW's chances. In the end the deal was similar to what the South-Korean government together with Hyundai seems to offer ("buy our stuff, then we buy your stuff"), but the Norwegian government had issues securing sufficient funds for the U212CD (or considered TKMS' offer to be too expensive), hence delaying the program. Maybe they could swap out one U212CD and buy Leopard 2 tanks instead for a little less money.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, SH_MM said:

 

I wonder if the U212CD submarines will affect KMW's chances. In the end the deal was similar to what the South-Korean government together with Hyundai seems to offer ("buy our stuff, then we buy your stuff"), but the Norwegian government had issues securing sufficient funds for the U212CD (or considered TKMS' offer to be too expensive), hence delaying the program. Maybe they could swap out one U212CD and buy Leopard 2 tanks instead for a little less money.

 

Pretty much zero chance of that happening IMO. After the F-35, new submarines are almost certainly among the projects with the highest priority, and 4 submarines are already on the low side (currently we have 6 Ula-class subs). Yes, there have been several delays before the production has even started (in addition to the reason you mentioned, it's going to take time for two navies to sit down and agree upon a common design, and there has also been a desire to include additional countries to bring down costs), but I do think that we’ll see a contract before the end of the year.

 

I’m less certain about the tank replacement project, even though KMW has reportedly stated that they can be pretty flexible when it comes to payment since they consider Norway to be a reliable customer (IIRC it was reported in this article by AldriMer.no, though it now sits behind a paywall…), and a Norwegian order would be placed behind those of other countries anyway with the possible exception of a dozen or so vehicles that Norway would need for its VJTF deployments. A competition will extend the project even further, however, so that could be another reason to go this route.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...