2805662 Posted December 11, 2018 Report Share Posted December 11, 2018 11 minutes ago, SH_MM said: Doesn't the British army have any system similar to IDZ-ES or GLADIUS 2? For years the British Army had a program called “FIST” (future infantry soldier technology or similar). Having used the FIST BMS software back in the day, all I can say is “no thank you” - real gen zero stuff. Putting it on was like falling into a pit of snakes (lots of cables)...just one problem amongst many. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade334 Posted December 11, 2018 Report Share Posted December 11, 2018 2 hours ago, Ramlaen said: I hope that isn't the mortar because it looks like you have to exit the tank to use it. It also doesn't look like the most practical place to add a mortar (if it were me I'd have it set on the turret roof behind the two hatches, where you could at least manually reload it) as its implies you have to traverse the entire turret to get it to bear onto its target. As for elevation, I'm not sure that wire sticking out at the bottom of the mount is meant to pull the tube towards the desired angle or if it's a data cable (in which case, I have to wonder whether the mortar barrel isn't actually some sort of antenna like a mini-CREW Duke, but then again...it's still a weird place to put such a device, since you could put that on the back of the turret). And besides, what is that mortar supposed to shoot? A large smokescreen canister? Chaff? Don't tell me it's just an HE shell, leave that stuff to the infantry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Moyes Posted December 11, 2018 Report Share Posted December 11, 2018 1 hour ago, SH_MM said: Doesn't the British army have any system similar to IDZ-ES or GLADIUS 2? Dismounted Situational Awareness (DSA) under the 'Morpheus' programme.https://royalsignals.org/FileTransfer/RSI_LE_TacCIS_Roadshow.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_James Posted December 12, 2018 Report Share Posted December 12, 2018 That is such an incredibly retarded location to place the mortar, just leave it off if it’s that big a problem, or place it in the external storage bins. I guess tank design has never been a strong suite of the British, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heretic88 Posted December 12, 2018 Report Share Posted December 12, 2018 That mortar is completely useless. Impossible to aim, impossible to reload in combat conditions. Even ancient WW2 german Nahverteidigungswaffe would be 1000% more useful. All in all, this "upgrade" is quite disappointing, looks like if somebody without any expertise with tanks would have thrown it together. I agree with Looser, the T-72B urban upgrade was far better than this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Moyes Posted December 12, 2018 Report Share Posted December 12, 2018 It's just a test platform, not an official upgrade. The mortar was placed there to use the existing smoke launcher mount and wire. 120mm smoothbore now a requirement for LEP: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N-L-M Posted December 12, 2018 Report Share Posted December 12, 2018 Brits paying for new turrets? More likely they end up buying surplus M1A1 turrets (from those vehicles converted to CEVs and bridgelayers or whatever) and upgrade them. Also, weekly reminder that Drummond is a hack. Scav, Laviduce and Lord_James 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xlucine Posted December 28, 2018 Report Share Posted December 28, 2018 Nothing much new, but it does show the EO sensor on a stick quite well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Moyes Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 https://www.rheinmetall.com/en/rheinmetall_ag/press/news/latest_news/index_16512.php Clan_Ghost_Bear and Ramlaen 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clan_Ghost_Bear Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 Less competition for the Challenger 2 refresh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty_Zuk Posted January 21, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 3 minutes ago, Clan_Ghost_Bear said: Less competition for the Challenger 2 refresh? Honestly, I'd completely support the UK MoD at this point if they'd just pit the CEOs of Leonardo and Rheinmetall against each other for a rock-paper-scissors game and have the winner do the work as fast as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH_MM Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Clan_Ghost_Bear said: Less competition for the Challenger 2 refresh? No, BAE Systems just want to get a bit of the Boxer money. They're willing to trade 55% of their UK-based land vehicle division for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramlaen Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 Is it too early to take this as a guarentee the Challenger 2 is getting a new gun? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsh Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Ramlaen said: Is it too early to take this as a guarentee the Challenger 2 is getting a new gun? Sadly... yes. Much too early. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty_Zuk Posted January 21, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Ramlaen said: Is it too early to take this as a guarentee the Challenger 2 is getting a new gun? Even if Rheinmetall wins the chances of it getting a new gun is 50/50. Peter Hardisty, managing director of Rheinmetall Defence UK, talked in the following video about the LEP: Go to 3:00 for stuff about the Challenger 2. Notice he still talks mostly about electronics, not so much about a gun. Actually I haven't noticed any mention of a gun, so it seems they're either not going that way anymore and are perhaps trying to strike this deal at a low price, and try to capitalize on their know-how on the vehicle to later push for a gun upgrade as a separate program. Also at 2:58 my boy Vago Muradian says: Spoiler You have the Merkava, obviously... very Israeli. . . . Is that because of the short barrel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH_MM Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Mighty_Zuk said: Go to 3:00 for stuff about the Challenger 2. Notice he still talks mostly about electronics, not so much about a gun. Actually I haven't noticed any mention of a gun, so it seems they're either not going that way anymore and are perhaps trying to strike this deal at a low price, and try to capitalize on their know-how on the vehicle to later push for a gun upgrade as a separate program. Gun is being considered a key factor for Rheinmetall's offer in their slides for the investors' conference in January 2019. 1 hour ago, Mighty_Zuk said: Also at 2:58 my boy Vago Muradian says: Always find it ridiculous how people decide to speak about "the three best Western tank" (or four in this case) and then include the Challenger 2 over the Leclerc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TokyoMorose Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 15 minutes ago, SH_MM said: Always find it ridiculous how people decide to speak about "the three best Western tank" (or four in this case) and then include the Challenger 2 over the Leclerc... At least nobody puts the C1 in that competition! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty_Zuk Posted January 21, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 1 hour ago, SH_MM said: Gun is being considered a key factor for Rheinmetall's offer in their slides for the investors' conference in January 2019. Always find it ridiculous how people decide to speak about "the three best Western tank" (or four in this case) and then include the Challenger 2 over the Leclerc... Is the program budget set for approximately 800 million euro, or are Rheinmetall saying they can do the LEP including switching a gun for that amount? Thanks btw. 53 minutes ago, TokyoMorose said: At least nobody puts the C1 in that competition! Still better than the CR2. #ChangeMyMind Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scav Posted January 21, 2019 Report Share Posted January 21, 2019 41 minutes ago, Mighty_Zuk said: Still better than the CR2. #ChangeMyMind Atleast it uses a modern gun.... and isn't 75 tonnes fully upgraded.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Moyes Posted January 22, 2019 Report Share Posted January 22, 2019 The sights appear to be the same as Ajax from Thales UK. Mighty_Zuk and Ramlaen 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Moyes Posted January 22, 2019 Report Share Posted January 22, 2019 Ramlaen, skylancer-3441 and Mighty_Zuk 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SH_MM Posted January 22, 2019 Report Share Posted January 22, 2019 So Rheinmetall has dropped the SAS and MSSA in favor for putting new armor on the turret (or a brand new turret, that looks extremely similar to the original Challenger 2 turret and mounts the same components in the same locations... ). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clan_Ghost_Bear Posted January 22, 2019 Report Share Posted January 22, 2019 Looks like BAE will have to offer a bit more than the Black Knight if they want to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramlaen Posted January 22, 2019 Report Share Posted January 22, 2019 I am skeptical that Rheinmetall would want to make a Leopard 2 competitor, it sounds more like a scheme to sell whole tanks to the UK instead of new turrets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mighty_Zuk Posted January 22, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2019 21 minutes ago, Ramlaen said: I am skeptical that Rheinmetall would want to make a Leopard 2 competitor, it sounds more like a scheme to sell whole tanks to the UK instead of new turrets. It's not really a competitor if none makes Challenger 2 hulls anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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