Jump to content
Sturgeon's House

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 542
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

Restricted: for Operating Thetan Eyes Only By order of Her Gracious and Serene Majesty Queen Diane Feinstein the VIII The Dianetic People’s Republic of California Anno Domini 2250

Comrades! The time of your waiting is over! I introduce to you the Sierra Nevada VagonZavod AFV-50 Gun Tank   Frontal Dimensions Frontal Armor Turret Cheek Armor Array (n

Report from Lt. Col. [REDACTED] People's Auditory Forces Directorate of Political-Moral Reliability, Auditory and Political Officer for SNVZ and Military-Industry Liaison Officer for RFP "New Battle T

On 3/23/2019 at 5:07 PM, N-L-M said:

E.      Deseret 40mm AC/ Cascadian 35mm AC
These autocannon share broadly similar AP performance, and are considered a likely threat for the foreseeable future, on Deseret armored cars, Cascadian tank destroyers, and likely also future IFVs.

 

What is the estimated penetration of 35mm and 40mm AP rounds?

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, T___A said:

Attention trans ladies, natal-ladies, and other, equally valid genders

qhX9hvQ.jpg

 

It is I, Her Gracious and Serene Majesty Queen Diane Feinstein the VIII, I have been keeping a close eye on this competition and frankly I think we can do better. The Dianetic People’s Republic of California is, after all, the most diverse country in the world. Our diversity quota ensure that only one cishet white male is allowed on your design team. Anyway, I think that we aim for the stars with this new tank and should have a gun that accomplishes that. I am adjusting the requirements: The gun must use traditional AP rounds. Sub-caliber rounds limit our ability to develop high-explosive rounds which, is the main ammo type of our tanks. One of my aides informs me that full-bore AP is more effective against NERA. Also the phallic structure of sub-caliber rounds enforces toxic heteromasculinity. The requirements for this new gun should be around 8 inches of penetration at 1.25 miles at .1200 minutes of an arc. That way this tank can defeat anything those Cascadians Chuds can throw at us.

 

3 hours ago, T___A said:

Oh, I forgot to mention, that comic sans is the now the official font of The Dianetic People’s Republic of California because people with dyslexic enhanced brains can read it better than other fonts.

 

As you wish her majesty, the most Gracious and Serene Queen Feinstein VIII! 

 We have recently introduced our new gender equity policy and" taken care of" our excess cishet white males. Our new most skilled and autistic genderfluid dyslexic engineers are hard to work for satisfy your needs! No less than 8 inches! 

We will make sure all our guns satisfy your needs! 

 

 

3 hours ago, N-L-M said:

Praise be unto Her Glorious and Wise Majesty. 

So it is written, so it shall be.

Long live our Great and divine Queen for a thousand years!

Let her words be heard!

 

 

 

 

(On a side note, got damn, now I need to fit a huge 200mm gun into my poor, tiny, special panser. )

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, T___A said:

Attention trans ladies, natal-ladies, and other, equally valid genders

qhX9hvQ.jpg

 

It is I, Her Gracious and Serene Majesty Queen Diane Feinstein the VIII, I have been keeping a close eye on this competition and frankly I think we can do better. The Dianetic People’s Republic of California is, after all, the most diverse country in the world. Our diversity quota ensure that only one cishet white male is allowed on your design team. Anyway, I think that we aim for the stars with this new tank and should have a gun that accomplishes that. I am adjusting the requirements: The gun must use traditional AP rounds. Sub-caliber rounds limit our ability to develop high-explosive rounds which, is the main ammo type of our tanks. One of my aides informs me that full-bore AP is more effective against NERA. Also the phallic structure of sub-caliber rounds enforces toxic heteromasculinity. The requirements for this new gun should be around 8 inches of penetration at 1.25 miles at 1200 minutes of an arc. That way this tank can defeat anything those Cascadians Chuds can throw at us.

 

 

 

 

The dianetic firm of Hakika si Kundi la Dudes Nyeupe (HKDN) hears and obeys.

 

On this front, we are delighted to report that our existing Brick junior design, if stretched a little, is capable of firing full-bore AP-FS which will meet the Most Gracious and Serene Majesty's requirements. The barrel has been rebored ever so slightly to 152mm. The propellant section dimensions are now 160x1050mm, while the warhead section is now 152x1050mm, bottlenecked to 160mm at the base. The shell is an entirely new design in line with scientologistic principles (and not, for instance, an ancient BR-540B shell with folding fins welded onto the end) and is expected to penetrate ~200mm at 2000m.

 

In other happy news, the design team has now been certified up to OT-7 thanks to the efforts of Chadina, who successfully petitioned for readjustment of her existing level after a tragic oversight by the relevant auditor in regards to her neuro-gifted tendencies. We trust that with this higher level of Operating Thetans, HKDN's design will more fully embody dianetic principles as it develops further going forwards.

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

So OOC (note: all in-character stuff will be in comic sans from now on) but I feel like this competition has made me properly understand some of the dilemmas of modern AFV design for the first time.

 

There's nothing like designing something and running the numbers yourself to give you a visceal understanding of it, and seeing just how much reactive armour elements add to the mix (and how much tandem charges fuck things up) is impressive. I think the key difference is that, heretofore, we always used simple modifiers of RHA effectiveness to represent the active armour elements. And these simply don't capture what's going on very well.

 

So I'd like to thank @N-L-M and company for the learning experience going on here. It's appreciated gents (and trans-gents, ladies, transladies, gender-neutral conglomerate entities etc).

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/2/2019 at 5:56 PM, T___A said:

Attention trans ladies, natal-ladies, and other, equally valid genders

qhX9hvQ.jpg

 

It is I, Her Gracious and Serene Majesty Queen Diane Feinstein the VIII, I have been keeping a close eye on this competition and frankly I think we can do better. The Dianetic People’s Republic of California is, after all, the most diverse country in the world. Our diversity quota ensure that only one cishet white male is allowed on your design team. Anyway, I think that we aim for the stars with this new tank and should have a gun that accomplishes that. I am adjusting the requirements: The gun must use traditional AP rounds. Sub-caliber rounds limit our ability to develop high-explosive rounds which, is the main ammo type of our tanks. One of my aides informs me that full-bore AP is more effective against NERA. Also the phallic structure of sub-caliber rounds enforces toxic heteromasculinity. The requirements for this new gun should be around 8 inches of penetration at 1.25 miles at 1200 minutes of an arc. That way this tank can defeat anything those Cascadians Chuds can throw at us.

 

Your Majesty!

 

Our company, Aegis of Pacific, promises to fulfill your (and our) expectations so we'd like to create very well protected tank (as well as other ones) but it will be lighter, faster and more innovative machine than these cascadian chuds' junk and our rivals' machines! Unfortunately, our team has managed to create AP rounds to our gun which penetrates only 7'7" RHA plate at 1.25 miles but we could do it using our genial cannon which has only 110mm caliber! The other ones wants to create 6" and greater cannons to their tanks but our product will have higher rate of fire so we can supress those p**cks from Seattle in the future!

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Lord_James said:

@Collimatrix, any sneak peaks at your crazy road wheels and suspension? 

Now I am intrigued.

 

 

2 hours ago, Lord_James said:

Edit: also, for anyone, how is the mass efficiency calculated for the available armor materials? Is it “to defeat a reference threat, the mass of armor is [ratio] compared to steel”? 

I would assume they simply used a shell that could penetrate something like a 50mm steel plate, found the needed thickness for the other material, and divided it by the total mass.

 

For example:

A 50mm steel plate would stop shell A.

A 150mm aluminum plate would stop shell A.

Aluminum is close to 1/3 the weight of steel. 

Therefor: 3 times the thickness divided by 1/3 the weight would equal a mass efficiency of 1. 

 

Extremely simplified of course. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, Xoon said:

 

For example:

A 50mm steel plate would stop shell A.

A 150mm aluminum plate would stop shell A.

Aluminum is close to 1/3 the weight of steel. 

Therefor: 3 times the thickness divided by 1/3 the weight would equal a mass efficiency of 1. 

 

Extremely simplified of course. 

 

For Al 5083 compared to RHA: 

 

RHA 1cm x 1cm x 10cm is 78g, and can absorb 100mm of penetration. 

 

Al 5083  kinetic TE is 0.3, so 1cm x 1cm x 33.3cm is 89.9g, to stop the same KE threat. The ratio between RHA and Al mass is 0.87. 

 

Al 5083 cumulative TE is 0.33, so 1cm x 1cm x 30.3cm is 81.8g, and the ratio is 0.95. 

 

These numbers are close to the OP, but several other ratios are given with accuracy to 2 decimal places. I’m just looking for clarification. 

 

Also, shouldn’t HHA have a mass efficiency of 2 as it is the same density as RHA, but takes half the thickness of armor (and therefore half the mass, if no other dimensions are altered) to stop the same reference threat? 

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Lord_James said:

@Collimatrix, any sneak peaks at your crazy road wheels and suspension? 

 

Edit: also, for anyone, how is the mass efficiency calculated for the available armor materials? Is it “to defeat a reference threat, the mass of armor is [ratio] compared to steel”? 

L-O can be calculated against targets with different densities and hardnesses (to a point), which gives you an idea of the KE mass and thickness equivalence of many bulk materials.

I've used this in the past to look at how efficient bone or diamond might be as armour materials, for instance.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hull of  the "Song Heavy - 1st Tank" (SH-1T, pun included :))

 

BYb8T5R.png

 

it is 8m long, 3.95m wide (plus an additional 0.04m when I get the basic side skirts modeled), and 1.7m high. Weighs 24.3 Mg (I'm just gonna use Megagrams, so neither I nor others get confused which 'ton' I'm talking about) currently. 

 

It has 5 armor cavities in the hull: 

 

1. Lower Hull: 50mm RHA + 585mm array + 50mm "Janet Pressed Armor" (JPA)* angled at 45o. 919mm LoS 

2. Left Upper Hull: : 40mm RHA + 200mm array + 40mm JPA angled at 75o. 1082mm LoS 

3. Right Upper Hull: 50mm RHA + 380mm array + 50mm JPA angled at 60o. 960mm LoS 

4. Lower Hull Sides: 20mm HHA + 850mm track/suspension + 20mm RHA + 100mm array + 45mm JPA. At 30o, 2070mm LoS. At 45o, 1464 LoS 

5. Upper Hull Sides: 20mm RHA + 850mm fuel tanks/spare parts bins +20mm RHA + 100mm array + 45mm JPA. same LoS as lower sides. 

 

In addition, there is also a 50mm JPA bulkhead between the engine and crew compartments, a double floor, and a separated forward propellant magazine. Array composition coming soontm.

 

I have yet to make a hole for the turret as I need to model the carousel loader and turret basket. Also don't worry about the forward hull sides not having an array, I have other plans for them :ph34r: 

 

 

 

*Song Industries proprietary armor technology. "Janet Pressed Armor" (JPA) was invented by Mann/Song liaison Janet Wilde; It has a ME of 1 and TE of 1.15-1.20 compared to RHA, can be produced in thicknesses between 25mm and 90mm without sacrificing efficiency, and can also be welded and used as a structural component. Unfortunately, it is more difficult and time consuming to produce than RHA, so use in vehicles will be restrained. (I'll tell you guys what it is when the competition is over, but @N-L-M confirmed that it is valid for the competition) 

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Lord_James said:

 

Somewhere between the rear of the hull and the driver’s hatch. I mentioned why I haven’t made a hole for the turret in my post. 

pft, who needs turrets anyways? 

 

 

Anyways, completed my suspension unit:
W4wNmVd.png

 

If anyone is interested in knowing how the suspension works, feel free to ask. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

More picks of the SH-1T, now with road wheels and 2 new armor cavities! 

 

Spoiler

h2WkcwW.png

 

aYcoEER.png

 

Weight is up to 35.86 Mg, with the suspension and wheels taking up 8.6 Mg by themselves (steel torsion bars with 850mm diameter aluminum wheels). 

 

New Armor cavities: 

 

6. Engine Compartment Roof: 30mm RHA + 60mm array + 30mm JPA at 7o. 992mm LoS 

7. Crew Compartment Roof: 25mm RHA + light NERA + 36mm JPA. might reverse angle the NERA or change the material, as I'm getting disappointingly low numbers for roof protection. 

 

I also raised the crew compartment floor, so no one can trip over the autoloader, though this reduces the head room from 1.45m to 1.26m. 

 

near future: 

 

A. mock up turret and carousel loader. 

B. extend the sponsons backwards to make space for a rear idler, additional cover for the rear door, and rear aesthetics. 

C. place ammo racks (the current front space can fit 42 charges). 

D. armor arrays and side skirts. 

 

later: 

 

E. Upgrade kits 

F. front dozer blade (a la T-72)

G. alternate turrets/vehicles 

Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎4‎/‎2‎/‎2019 at 5:56 PM, T___A said:

Attention trans ladies, natal-ladies, and other, equally valid genders

qhX9hvQ.jpg

 

It is I, Her Gracious and Serene Majesty Queen Diane Feinstein the VIII, I have been keeping a close eye on this competition and frankly I think we can do better. The Dianetic People’s Republic of California is, after all, the most diverse country in the world. Our diversity quota ensure that only one cishet white male is allowed on your design team. Anyway, I think that we aim for the stars with this new tank and should have a gun that accomplishes that. I am adjusting the requirements: The gun must use traditional AP rounds. Sub-caliber rounds limit our ability to develop high-explosive rounds which, is the main ammo type of our tanks. One of my aides informs me that full-bore AP is more effective against NERA. Also the phallic structure of sub-caliber rounds enforces toxic heteromasculinity. The requirements for this new gun should be around 8 inches of penetration at 1.25 miles at 1200 minutes of an arc. That way this tank can defeat anything those Cascadians Chuds can throw at us.

 

 

 

 

So in case anyone is wondering (not that I'm advocating anything for or against anything), the minimum specs needed to punch through 203mm RHA sloped at 20' degrees from vertical at 2000m is:

- 122m gun, ~12.3MJ muzzle energy

- 25kg APBC, 992m/s (mass and penetration based on 122mm BR-471D)

 

So this can in principle be achieved using a hot D-25T

Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, Toxn said:

So in case anyone is wondering (not that I'm advocating anything for or against anything), the minimum specs needed to punch through 203mm RHA sloped at 20' degrees from vertical at 2000m is:

- 122m gun, ~12.3MJ muzzle energy

- 25kg APBC, 992m/s (mass and penetration based on 122mm BR-471D)

 

So this can in principle be achieved using a hot D-25T

 

Well the T-10M's main gun can do it. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • N-L-M unfeatured this topic

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Similar Content

    • By Toxn
      This is the competition entry thread.
       
      Please submit your complete entries here (all entries will be judged complete when judging begins in the first week of November) and keep the other competition thread for discussion and chatter.
       
      Once judging is complete I will make a post here to discuss the entries and announce a winner.
       
      Best of luck!
       
      Update: final submissions should be in hand by the 22nd of November 2020.
    • By SH_MM
      Found a few higher resolution photographs from the recent North Korean military parade. We didn't have a topic for BEST KOREAN armored fighting vehicles, so here it is.
       
      New main battle tank, Abrams-Armata clone based on Ch'ŏnma turret design (welded, box-shaped turret) and Sŏn'gun hull design (i.e. centerline driver's position). The bolts of the armor on the hull front is finally visible given the increased resolution. It might not be ERA given the lack of lines inbetween. Maybe is a NERA module akin to the MEXAS hull add-on armor for the Leopard 2A5?
       
      Other details include an APS with four radar panels (the side-mounted radar panels look a lot different - and a lot more real - than the ones mounted at the turret corners) and twelve countermeasures in four banks (two banks à three launchers each at the turret front, two banks à three launchers on the left and right side of the turret). Thermal imagers for gunner and commander, meteorological mast, two laser warning receivers, 115 mm smoothbore gun without thermal sleeve but with muzze reference system, 30 mm grenade launcher on the turret, six smoke grenade dischargers (three at each turret rear corner)
       


       
      IMO the layout of the roof-mounted ERA is really odd. Either the armor array covering the left turret cheek is significantly thinner than the armor on the right turret cheek or the roof-mounted ERA overlaps with the armor.
       


      The first ERA/armor element of the skirt is connected by hinges and can probably swivel to allow better access to the track. There is a cut-out in the slat armor for the engine exhaust. Also note the actual turret ring - very small diameter compared to the outer dimensions of the turret.
       
      Stryker MGS copy with D-30 field gun clone and mid engine:

      Note there are four crew hatches. Driver (on the left front of the vehicle), commander (on the right front of the vehicle, seat is placed a bit further back), gunner (left side of the gun's overhead mount, next to the gunner's sight) and unknown crew member (right side of gun's overhead mount with 30 mm automatic grenade launcher mounted at the hatch). The vehicle also has a thermal imager and laser rangefinder (gunner's sight is identical to the new tank), but no independent optic for the commander. It also has the same meteorological mast and laser warner receivers as the new MBT.
       
      What is the purpose of the fourth crew member? He cannot realistically load the gun...
       
      The vehicle has a small trim vane for swimming, the side armor is made of very thin spaced steel that is bend on multiple spots, so it clearly is not ceramic armor as fitted to the actual Stryker.

       
      The tank destroyer variant of the same Stryker MGS copy fitted with a Bulsae-3 ATGM launcher.
       

      Note that there is again a third hatch with 30 mm automatic grenade launcher behind the commander's position. Laser warning receivers and trime vane are again stand-out features. The sighting complex for the Bulsae-3 ATGMs is different with a large circular optic (fitted with cover) probably being a thermal imager and two smaller lenses visible on the very right (as seen from the vehicle's point of view) probably containing a day sight and parts of the guidance system.
       

      Non line-of-sight ATGM carrier based on the 6x6 local variant of the BTR, again fitted with laser warning receivers and a trim vane. There are only two hatches and two windows, but there is a three men crew inside.
       
       
      There are a lot more photos here, but most of them are infantry of missile system (MLRS' and ICBMs).
    • By Toxn
      You are an engineer at an Italian locomotive and tractor-making company in early 1943. The writing is on the wall for the Italian army in North Africa, with a lot of equipment having been lost and the enemy on the brink of kicking the axis out of Tunisia and then heading across the Mediterranean. In short, things are looking more than a little desperate. 
       
      However, all is not lost. Il Duce himself has stepped in and, with the assistance of the Germans, procured both some of their finest captured vehicles for use in the upcoming defense of the homeland. Since many of these vehicles have been... gently used, and the existing firms like Ansaldo are flooded with orders, your firm has been asked to work on them in order to bring them up to the standards demanded by modern warfare. 
       
      In addition to these vehicles, the Germans have also graciously agreed to sell weapons from their existing stock of captured equipment, as well as providing production licenses for some of their more modern equipment. You have also been given permission to work with local weapons manufacturers in order to modify existing artillery to suit your needs. Italian automotive and engine manufacturers are similarly available to help. Finally; your firm's experience in locomotives and tractors means that you can modify hulls and put together turrets and turret rings. You can also produce castings (although not very large ones) and weld armour plates.
       
      Your job, which you have no choice but to accept, is to choose a vehicle from among the captured stock being offered for sale, and propose a series of plausible fixes in order to give it a fighting chance against the American and British equipment currently in the field (specifically light tanks and light anti-tank weapons).
       
      It is not foreseen that any of these vehicles will be able to plausibly take on modern medium or heavy designs head-on. Instead, what is wanted are general, implementable improvements to the characteristics of the chosen vehicle. These improvements should be aimed at making these vehicles more useful in the initial battles which are foreseen taking place against airborne and landing forces, in general cooperation with infantry, and as scouts.
       
      The submission should include one or more drawings or blueprints (at least a side view of the vehicle, but preferably a 3-point view and isometric view), a description of the modified vehicle, a description of how the modifications would be accomplished and a description of how the modifications would improve the design overall. The text of the submission should short and descriptive rather than long and exhaustive, and should not exceed 1000 words in total. Images may be photoshopped using existing pictures.
       
      Judging will be done on the basis of plausibility and effectiveness, with innovative solutions being encouraged in order to get the most bang for buck out of the base vehicle. Beyond implementation, the fixes should prioritise combat effectiveness while also improving reliability, crew ergonomics, communication, mobility and protection as much as possible.
       
      The foreign vehicles available for modification are:
      Renault R35 (already in service) Hotchkiss H35/39 Somua S35 (already in use for training purposes) T-26 BT-5 T-28 (only available in very small numbers, so need to be extremely effective) Panzer II Ausf.C  
      The foreign weapons immediately available for purchase are:
      15mm ZB-60 25mm Puteaux and Hotchkiss 3.7cm KPÚV vz. 34/Pak 34 (t) 3.7cm ÚV vz. 38/KwK 38(t)
      3.7cm Pak 36 4.0 cm Pak 192 (e) 45mm M1937 (53-K) 4.7cm KPÚV vz. 38/Pak 38 (t) 47mm APX 7.5cm Pak 97/38 7.62 cm F.K.297(r) and  7.62 cm PaK 39(r) 8.8cm Raketenwerfer 43  
      Licenses are also available for the manufacture of foreign engines (Maybach HL62 TRM, Maybach HL120 TRM and Praga Typ TNHPS/II), periscopes, sights, radios, cupolas and automotive subassemblies. All foreign vehicle weapons, subassemblies and components are available for reverse engineering and manufacture.
       
      IMPORTANT NOTE: This competition hasn't been finalised, and is waiting on your input! Vote to participate by giving this topic a 'controversial' (grapefruit-induced tears being the only currency of value), and if we get enough participants we'll pull the trigger. Ask any questions you want below, and when/if the competition goes forwards I will make a new thread for entries.
       
      Edit: thanks to excellent feedback, the competition proposal has been somewhat edited. If you want an idea of what my mindset is here, read up on the battle of Gela (bearing in mind that the wikipedia entry is shite) and ask how much better the counter-attack could have gone if the Italian vehicles had been equipped with radios and had the ability to move faster than jogging speed.
       
      Edit 2: since I failed to mention this above - this is not a one-man, one-entry sort of competition (although I'm not keen on the ten-men, one entry approach either).
      If you have two good ideas then you can submit twice. The only rules are not to test my patience and to keep it within the bounds of good taste.
    • By Toxn
      So I got a request recently from {NAME REDACTED} as to whether we have a how-to guide or something for competitions. After a few moments of bitter, bitter laughter at the decade-plus of my life that I've spent cobbling together things that can maybe, sort-of, squint-your-eyes produce a facsimile of a realistic vehicle, I thought I'd share my process:
       
       
      Note: I was half-right - we definitely have supplementary info for aspiring pretend tank designers pinned to this very board.
       
      Finally, I'm inviting our forum grognards and past winners to share their process for folk that haven't been here since before the last ice age, so that all can benefit.

×
×
  • Create New...