That_Baka

2 hours ago, heretic88 said:

 

No. I think the only sane option was to finish the 477, with somewhat simplified FCS. Objekt-187 didnt have enough improvements over existing tanks, especially the T-80U.

I really doubt that stuffing tanker into kharkovite deathtrap is good idea. For all its incredible parameters crew still encapsulated by ammo such solutions are acceptable in 1970-80 but not now.

Yes it is ready to adobtion and only  things that need update is thermal sight.

Kalashnikov-Petrov self loading carabine

Fixed i think

Kovrov experimental stuff

1) 7.62x54mmR I.N Kolesnikov MG. Delayed blowback action . 1926.

2) 7.62x54mmR KoCo Kovrov Collective rifle .1928. Short recoil

3)DP with feed system designed  by G.F Kubynov S.G Razorenov .Uses stripper clips.

4)7.62x54mmR Yurchencko YuAS Shvkal MG.Short recoil operation

5)7.62x54mmR KB-P-610 LMG . Bigger brother of RPD. 1949.

6)7.62x39mm A.S Konstantinov 2-B-P-40 LMG.Delayed blowback.

6)7.62x54mmR A.S Konstantinov 2-B-V-10 sniper rifle. Gas operated rotating bolt action.

@EnsignExpendable
Looser'd

https://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/a-new-rifle-for-russia-the-ak-not-the-first-kalashnikov.648275/#post-47421080

Kalshnikov gun journal .Article about flechette ammo by Nikolay Dvoryaninov.

https://www.kalashnikov.ru/strelovidnye-puli-2/

https://www.kalashnikov.ru/strelovidnye-puli/

Is 32k  good enough barrel life for smoothbore machinegun?

Experimental  soviet fletchette rounds and comparison with conventional ammo

SVDG (Smoothbore SVD )and PKG (smoothbore PK)

@Collimatrix

Sorry for the waiting and confusion i.e article was avtomats in 7.62 and their history.

Anyway part two

By the end 1946 Red Army was in same situation as 3 year back: there wasnt any avtomat that fully satisficied Army requirements.Development of new avtomats and chosing best from newly developed avtomats was neccesary .Soon GAU announces beginning of new trials for avtomat and one of participant of the competition was young reserve seniour sergeant  M.T Kalashnikov with 5 five prototype guns build in metal behind his back .

Simonov Avtomat As-4-P-44

Degtyarev Avtomat KB-P-315

Preparatory stage of the competition for second avtomat trials with intermediate cartrige (May-October 1946)

Factoring in difficulties with designing new avtomat Firearm Directorate of GAU KA announced new avtomat competition.

Design of Avtomats should be conducted based on refined Tactical Technical Requirement № 3131–45 in doing so suggested that trial should encompass most experienced designers .Сompetition involved couple of design bureaus such as:

-KB-2 and PKB OGK (Kovrov) V.V Degtyarev,S.V Vladimirov,P.P Polyakov and A.P Bolshakov,V.V Zubov, V.A Vedensky , I.I Slostin and E.V Ivanov ,A.A Dementiev ,G.F Kubynov,  S.M Krekin

-KB of plant № 535 (Tula) S.A Korovin

-KB NIPSMVO(Shurovo vilage) N.V Rukavishnikov ,K.A Baryshev ,M.T Kalashnikov

-KB of Red Army Artillery Academy (Moscow) I.K Bezruchko-Vysotsky

-TSkB-14 (Tula)  A.A Bulkin ,G.A Korobov

-KB-180 (Podolsk) S.G Simonov, N.N Efimov

Tokarev Avtomat AT-44

Korovin Avtomat first version

Korovin Avtomat 1946 version

In order to reduce time and resources in beggining  competition whcih  should be proceed in two round. USV GAU received 16 project in the first round.Competition commsion basing upo order of chief of GAU from  June 19 of 1946 and conditions of competions chosen 10 designs for participation in competition (projects of A.A Dementiev,P.P Polyakov,K.A Baryshev, A.P Bolshakov, S.V Vladimirov,N.V Rukavishnikov, M.T Kalashnikov, G.A Korobov,A.A Bulkin, I.I Rakov).Interestingly some of participant brought working firearms alongside technical documentation(S.A Korrovin ,G.F Kubynov,S.G Simonov, N.N Efimov)

Priluchsky Avtomat 

1-st variant of Kubynov Avtomat

Efimov Avtomat Ap-34 OKB-180

10 was participant was allowed to entry second round six of them was considered as generally satifisfactory according to tactical technical requirements (Projects of K.A Baryshev,A.A Dementiev,N.V Rukavishnikov,G.A Korobov,A.A Bulkin,M.T Kalashnikov).Project of I.I Rakov,S.G Simonov,P.P Polyakov,A.P Bolshakov have design flaws and therefore wasnt recommended for continuation of development.In same time commsion decided that not a single project was deserver 1- prize.Commision given 2-nd prize to N.V Rukavishnikov. Encouragement Prizes received A.A Dementiev,K.A Baryshev,A.A Bulkin,M.T Kalashnikov.

1 hour ago, Collimatrix said:

 

Any updates?

I will try to translate second bit soon™.

Link:https://www.kalashnikov.ru/v-samom-nachale/

Lets begun proper translation .

After examining German auto-carbines Mkb.42H and its modification MP-43 in USSR quickly begun work on domestic intermediate power cartridge .By the august of 1943 specialist from Artillery Committee of GAU developed tactical technical specification № 2456–43 for entire family of firearms such as self-loading carbine , handheld machinegun(LMG) and Avtomat. Initial primary requirements for supposed avtomat are as such:

-Total weight of Avtomat shouldn't exceed 5 kilograms including magazine, bipod and bayonet

-Length of Avtomat shouldn't exceed 1200-1300mm with bayonet  

-Length without bayonet shouldn’t exceed 900-1000mm

-Avtomat must feed from detachable 30 rounds box magazine

-Avtomat should have open iron sight sighted to 1000 meters with 50 meters increments

-Groupings in semi-auto should be equal to 7.62 rifle mod 1891/30 while and in automatic fire should be comparable to DP machinegun

-Rate of Fire shouldn't be more than 600 round per minute. Practical firerate when firing in 3-5 bursts no less than 80 round per minute while in semi auto no less than 35 round per minute

-Durability of system shouldn't be less than 20000 rounds

Designer are designed weapon for cartridge that are haven’t yet appeared .Cartridge and firearm are designed concurrently which lead to considerable difficulties in the process of the design .Work on design of new cartrige begun at in jule 1943 by specialists of OKB-44 (Kuntcevo village) N.V Elizarov ,P.V Rozanov surmounting massive technical difficulties design of the cartridge finalized by end of 1943 and formally adopted in september of 1943 as "7.62 cartridge mod 1943".Using this cartirge and basing on tactical technical requirement № 2456–43 designers from various organisations set to work on new firearms .

In this trials participated :

-KB-2 and PKB OGK (Kovrov) V.V Degtyarev under leadershipof V.A Degtyarev 

-KB NIPSMVO(Shurovo vilage) A.I Sudaev V.F Kuzmishev

-KB of plant № 535 (Tula) S.A Korovin 

-KB-180 (Podolsk) S.G Simonov

-TSkB-14 (Tula) F.V Tokarev A.A Bulkin S.A Prilucsky

-KB of plant № 367 (Vyatskie Polyany known today as Molot orushie) G.S Shpagin

In the beginning of the work technical look of this weapon wasnt clear .In the beginning avtomat was seen by the GAU as universal firearm which combines advantage of LMG,SMG and rifle .This is clearly seen due to inclusion of bayonet and bipod into design.And it heavily influenced lenght of barrel which is 500mm which was calculated to provide longer range.Mkb.42 primary design solutions influenced work of certain designers and specialists from GAU .However it cannot be said that designer are strictly adhering to specification from GAU.Designs are extremely varied and diverse.Designs ranged from from enlarged SMG ( simple blowback action of Shpagin Avtomat ) to full-fledged LMGs that are incapable to serve as compact and light individual weapon such as Degtyarev KB-P-315 and KB-P-280 ,Simonov RPS-M3-44 and AS-4-P-44  and Bulkin AB-44 .Part of these Heavy Avtomats are moved to handheld Machineguns group where they are tested independently .

In order from left to right S.G Simonov,F.v Tokarev ,G.S Shpagin

In same order A.A Bulkin,V.V Degtyarev ,G.F Kubynov

Best out of all designs are emerged in NIPSMVO in AS-44 which was recommended for production of pre-production series .1000 was produced at Tula Plant №536 and in July 1945 entered service trials.Service trails revealed that As-44 satificied amjority of Army demands but its needed further refinement .Sudaev enthusiastically begun work on improving the rifle and managed to churn out couple of variats but sadly he was died from sickness in 1946.Sudaev doesnt have any helpers or students so after his death his work was left unfinished.

Shpagin avtomat

Kuzmishev Avtomat 

Part 2 will be continued tomorow

25 minutes ago, Hisname said:

Many thanks) Maybe there were more requirements?)))

Thats it .Article doesnt mentions any other requirements. But it is more guideline than strict requirement .For example on of the Degtyarev entries used pan magazine of 44 or 50 round capacity

Link:https://www.kalashnikov.ru/v-samom-nachale/

While on train i will try to translate tactical technical specification № 2456–43

-Total weight of Avtomat shouldn't exceed 5 kilograms including magazine,bipod and bayonet

-Lenght of Avtomat shouldn't exceed 1200-1300mm with bayonet  

-Lenght without bayonet shouldnt exceed 900-1000mm

-Avtomat must feed from detachable 30 rounds box magazine

-Avtomat should have open iron sight sighted to 1000 meters with 50 meters increments

-Groupings in semi-auto should be equal to 7.62 rifle mod 1891/30 and in automatic fire should be comparable to DP machinegun

-Rate of Fire shouldn't be more than 600 round per minute. Practical firerate when firing in 3-5 bursts no less than 80 round per minute while in semi auto no less than 35 round per minute

-Durability of system shouldn't be less than 20000 rounds

@Collimatrix

When i get to my pc in my family rural house i will try .ETA is 4 hours

Guys do interested in my (admittely shitty ) translation of 1944 avtomat trials article by Ruslan Chumak?

1 hour ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

Grab the Afganit's CPU and radars and put them in the Arena within Arena's architecture and you solved the aging problem.

 

The issue is that they're basically turning a niche vehicle (niche: being relatively very cheap and worthy of investment as backup reserve vehicle) into something that kind of defeats that niche, which in turn delegitimizes the entire concept of upgrading thousands of Soviet-era MBTs instead of buying hundreds of "Russia-era" MBTs.

 

Same could be said for equipping T-55 with Drozd's instead yet another try to replace T-64,T-72,T-80 with next gen kewl unified tank .I mean design work on T-64 replacement begun immidiately after T-64 adobtion

20 minutes ago, heretic88 said:

Except that the T-72 was more expensive in reality, and was less capable... Also in the second half of the '70s T-64 became reliable enough. This whole T-64/72/80 affair was nothing more than a sad story of infighting between tank design bureaus. This resulted in that the russian army stuck with now hopelessly obsolete T-72 tanks. The main victims of this infighting were such revolutionary designs as the Objekt-490A, Objekt-477, and perhaps also the Objekt-299.

 

 

 

Except that part that latter version T-72 are better armoured than T-64 and there are wasnt any indication that late T-64 have batter FCS than T-72 or T-80.Not the mention Object 187.

5 hours ago, Walter_Sobchak said:

I thought the SU-57 was a lend lease T48 gun motor carriage.  

 

Designation of SU-57 used for both this and upgunning project alonside post war ASU-57.For example in GAZ plant documents ASU-85 refered as SU-85.

3 hours ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

The watermark didn't help. I don't know who Warspot are. 

 

I knew from the beginning it was related to the SU-76 and remembered that there was a version with a 57mm gun, perhaps named SU-57.

 

But what finally confirmed this was a SU-57 was the fact that the link to the image contains the name. Right in the middle.

I taken this picture from Yuri Pasholok article on upgunning of Su-76M

https://warspot.ru/12623-lyogkie-sau-s-bolshimi-pushkami

6 minutes ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

 

Something related to the SU-76 I am sure. Same T-70 chassis, same superstructure, but the gun is elongated and lacks a muzzle break. 

Hmmm.

EDIT: It's a 57mm gun, so it's the SU-57. 

 

I understand now why I haven't found it on the webz. It always showed me that inferior Sukhoi bird instead.

May i presume that Warspot watermark helped in search? I should used SU-85B rear picture.

6 hours ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

Why dafuq did the IS-7 have 2 fixed/static rear facing machine guns?

That is, other than emergency propulsion.

Because tankers do not trust infantry to correctly form protective screen? I mean until 1945 it is main problem of the Soviet tanks corps that infatry divisions wouldn't keep up with tanks .

According Andrey Ulanov GABTU received counrless demands from  tankers to increase amount of machineguns and trophy MG42 are often covered turrets or hull of T-34-85,SU-85/100 and IS-2.

1 hour ago, Stimpy75 said:

Looser could you plz answer a little bit later

 

Object 430 related?