DIADES

On 9/6/2020 at 8:13 PM, SH_MM said:

Interoperability between different countries is the last step of fully adopting a GVA. First step is interoperability of all components within a vehicle, followed by adopting the common GVA for all vehicles in a country.

Australia already has two nascent GVA so it will be a long time before we converge.

16 hours ago, 2805662 said:

is closer to 35 metric tonnes, than 45 metric tonnes.

So you saw a Redback.  The question is, what config is that mass?  In particular, what protection level?  Not expecting you to answer that, me thinking as I type

1 hour ago, Kal said:

With an end point

Agreed.  My point is that we are not there yet.  And that is what we are talking about.   Now, well, the next 12 months roughly when the evaluation takes place.  That will use existing technology.

23 hours ago, 2805662 said:

Here you go

Excellent.  I still struggle.  Medium?  What does one those beasties weigh?

12 hours ago, Laser Shark said:

utfitted with AMAP add-on-armour by that time, so they probably weighed around 30 tonnes

Definitely getting up there .  Still another 15t or 50% to go to get to Ph3 weight class - no, I do not believe Hanwha (or Rheinmetall) weights.

11 hours ago, SH_MM said:

The electrically-powered Wotan 35 gun is still not fínished, but will be available in the near future.

I;ll bet they have dug up and jumpstarted the 50mm program too.

11 hours ago, SH_MM said:

Rheinmetall's xGVA, which is fully compatible with the NGVA (NATO STANAG 4754), the older and less comprehensive British DefStan 23-09 GVA and the DEF (AUST) 11316 Australian GVA.

Hilarious - the G in all these is Generic.....  The intent always was exactly that - generic.  Yet here we go with manufacturer and organizational unique "generic" architectures

8 hours ago, 2805662 said:

aren’t supported by evidence.

OK, yes rubber bands work on very light vehicles.  Please show me any evidence of a medium or heavy AFY on rubber track?

And - the repair is not apples and apples.  The rubber band repair does not return the track to fully functional - speed degraded and vibration increased - it is purely an expedient repair prior to replacement.

A repaired in the field conventional track is fully functional.  There is no comparison.

27 minutes ago, 2805662 said:

conventional track

But conventional track can be repaired by crew anywhere.  Rubber band needs to be replaced completely and I don't see carrying a whole spare track as practical.  Band track makes sense for training if the durability/cost trade off actually works.  But will be a liability in real operations.

12 hours ago, SH_MM said:

very opposite approach to the Puma'

yes, and in part due to the pivot turn stall problem arising from the Renk power flow in that mode and the MTU low idle torque.  Puma is very easily stalled without careful handling.

10 hours ago, Kal said:

Hanwha will have good facilities

I don't see how.  The deal on the table is 45 vehicles.  Rheinmetall built their facility of the back of 3,000 trucks and 225 BOXER.  Everything I hear about the Geelong setup is old school project model - set up, do the project, sack everybody and go home.  And sole sourcing makes that even more likely - no need for a competitive AIC case.

If they really do build a decent facility - Australia is the winner.  War is coming and having multiple AFV production facilities is a good thing.

10 hours ago, Kal said:

(So its intent to negotiate a sole source contract)

Yes, as long as they don't get greedy, they are a certainty. 

On 8/31/2020 at 11:17 PM, SH_MM said:

 

I wonder about axle weights.  That is a big lump of stuff!

23 hours ago, Kal said:

Its not just the vehicles

Agreed, it only about the occupants - shock, over-pressure, secondary effects etc - and I expect both will pass.  Both will have done a lot of testing themselves.  But - each and every blast is unique.  Despite being careful with charges, site and soils, every blast is unique so an um-anticipated failure is always in the cards.

23 hours ago, Kal said:

So less australian steel and less australian fabrication content.

Sorry, hard to be polite about this, Rubbish, pure rubbish and so one eyed that I can only assume that you are associated in some way with a certain Korean entity

In fact, Bisalloy is already exporting steel for use in Rheinmetall products fro non-Australian customers.  That is what supply chain access means - which is why the money was spent on German qualification.

23 hours ago, 2805662 said:

it trialled really

my sources tell me that crew comfort and overall vibration were much higher with the rubber track on M113 - really counter-intuitive.  I reckon I might have a report somehwere too, see if I can find it.

23 hours ago, 2805662 said:

hey were lucky not to be disqualified at that point

Everybody loves a winner   A calculated risk I expect

4 minutes ago, 2805662 said:

facility

Really?  Hi Ace?   The coke snortin marketing types probably shoulda talked to a few Australians before naming the facility after a very common, crappy tradesmans van!

On 8/31/2020 at 9:31 AM, Kal said:

rubber tracks,

I can't see the ADF buying rubber track.  No growth (mass limited), bloody hard to repair and Cultana will eat it up by the truckload.

On 8/30/2020 at 7:49 PM, Kal said:

welding and steel prequalificatio

Rheinmetall has been working with Bisalloy for years - many press releases.  They are working together to get Bisalloy qualified against German standards and I am pretty sure I saw a release celebarting success and I definitely saw one from Rheinmetall about getting welders qualified to German armour welding standards.  Don't forget, MLVEHCOE is gearing up to build BOXER.

On 8/30/2020 at 8:12 PM, 2805662 said:

economic repair,

Yep - to return to as new, fully functional.  But, to put into fit shape for a static show?  Different question - a marketing imperative, not an engineering view!

On 8/31/2020 at 9:31 AM, Kal said:

engine/tran,

Hanwha Allison about 1,900kg  Rheinmetall Renk about 1,700kg  Hanwha MTU about 1,400 kg Rheinmetall Liebherr about 1,800kg so Hanwha at about 3,600 kg plays Rheinmetall at about 3,200.  Now, eng and trans manufacturers are a bit dodgy with published weights - with fluids?  With accessories as installed?  So frankly, these powerpacks are near enough the same weight. 

On 8/30/2020 at 9:52 PM, Kal said:

Hanwha's AS21 strongest point compared to LYNX.

I disagree strongly :) both will pass under hull and under track and that is all that matters.  Rheinmetall has been building mine blast structures for a long time.  Rheinmetall BOXER in the L400 Ph2 RMA drove off the test area under its own power after an under hull blast.

The hard parts (for both teams) are EFP and IED side attack blasts.

3 hours ago, 2805662 said:

actual representative vehicles t

depends on mine blast timing and extent of repair required.  Certainly Rheinmetall has enough in country capability to repair if time permits.  Pretty sure the mine blast vehicles have no other role in RMA.

4 hours ago, 2805662 said:

wouldn’t be surprised if they’re not available

Nor would I but there is no way Hanwha and Rheinmetall will have empty stands!  There will a fair bit of fanfare around the handover of RMA vehicles so they will be sort of public domainish and the Primes will find ways to brag.