Alex C.

32 minutes ago, Belesarius said:

I wanna see video of it firing. 'Dat muzzle blast.

Unburned powder anyone?

Not that exact one but pretty close:

30 minutes ago, Belesarius said:

MC-51 or get out.

 

 

 

Get out of here with that bullshit

Ode to the G3 rifle:

22 hours ago, Sturgeon said:

Don't be a jerk to Alex lol.

17 hours ago, Oedipus Wreckx-n-Effect said:

Hey those new import PSLs are 2k plus now!

Also I was on the phone with Henry Chan of 9 Hole Reviews the other day and he said the PSL outshot the dragunov on their 1000 meter range!

Say what you will, but the PSL is a badass gun.

52 minutes ago, Sturgeon said:

Speaking of Estonia, looks like LMT will be replacing their Galils.

Interesting. LMT is killing it out there.

This thread needs more Daewoo.

1 hour ago, Oedipus Wreckx-n-Effect said:

Pretty sure @Ulric picked some of that up at a gun show we went to once.

Nice. I'm on the hunt for some proper 7n1 but it is very hard to find.

I am told that SVD accuacy is about 2moa with 7n1.

43 minutes ago, LoooSeR said:

 

First photo:

"Extra"

7.62

 

Target cartridges

[for rifles]

 

 

2nd photo:

High accuracy

 for 300 meters shooting

 

Bullet speed 750 m/s

Bullet weight 13 grams

Thanks @LoooSeR !

Is this brand of ammunition still made for commercial sale? I know the Novosibirsk ammunition plant is still there.

Edit: Apparently yes, they still make the stuff http://www.lveplant.ru/pages_en.php?id=49

A bit off topic, but @LoooSeR or anyone else fluent in Russian, can you help me translate this? A friend of mine gave it to me as he was clearing out his home. It is brass cased and headstamped 188 over 74:

I spent too much on a comically inaccurate rifle.

It came with the modern polymer furniture on it but retro is always cooler.

1 hour ago, Sturgeon said:

 

My understanding is FN themselves are mercurial and difficult to deal with.

I've not heard that but Finland is so stocked with 7.62 shit. The RK62 and RK95tp are... fine but cmon Finland. That said I do know they bought a shit ton of Chinese type 56 rifles designated the RK 56 TP (well over 100,000 rifles).

Finnish spec Chinese AK:

They also have over 100,000 East German AK rifles. I have heard they have up to 300k but sources always seem to vary.

While the active portion of the FDF is only ~33,000 they have a Reserve component of ~900,000. At least everyone gets something.

1 hour ago, Sturgeon said:

 

The Finns at least were considering SCARs, until they realized they'd have to deal with FN... 

Why is this particularly difficult? They arm the USA and half of Europe already. Surely they are more than capable of dealing with the Finnish MOD.

16 hours ago, Sturgeon said:

Those Estonian tactical-Galils really make me glad we have standardized on the AR-15 here in the US...

Oh yes, big time. Its hilarious watching countries with clown-shoe rifles bolting shit on to try and modernize. The Estonians, Finnish, South Koreans, etc. all have to bend over backwards. The Spanish approach of saying “fuck this” and getting G36s was the right course of action!

17 hours ago, Collimatrix said:

The 7.62x51mm Galils go for outrageous prices in the US.

I have seen maybe 2-3 Galatz rifles in the USA. They go for 15k or so. Your basic 7.62 gun goes for 4k-4.5kish.

Even the classic IWI factory guns in 5.56 are $3500 across the board. Kit builds are the way to go for a nice Galil nowadays, and kits are plentiful. It has never been easier to build a galil.

Edit: it was really hard to find photos of Israelis with Galils. They “M14ed” that gun very quickly. 

Showing the Galil some love (and Estonian/South African copies):

Rare "Galatz" marksman's variant:

The FNC and its variants need more love

Various photos of the modernized RK62 (and attempts over the years):

Also if anyone has one of the Finnish waffle AK mags plz hook me up.

1 hour ago, LoooSeR said:

   I'm implying that i see such weapon for the first time, a P90 made to look like AR-15 for some reason. 

It was/is a commercial product made so civilian shooters can convert their rifles to shoot 5.7x28mm.

I owned one for a brief period of time and it worked well but I sold it. I had no use for it after I bought a PS90.

So I collect AK mags and recently acquired a rare (in the USA) Russian Izzy AK103 polymer mag!

So I thought I might do magazine weights and measures. But first, the progression of the Russian 7.62x39 Kalashnikov magazine (minor variants not included):

From left to right:

First pattern "slabside", AKM stamped "generic", Aluminum waffle "paratrooper", RPK magazine (40 rounder), AKM "bakelite", Modern polymer AK103

Weights of magazines:

Slab:

Generic:

Aluminum "paratrooper":

RPK 40 rounder:

AKM bakelite:

Modern AK103:

Now for comparison, random magazines for other rifles:

Vz58:

Colt production M16/M4:

Izzy AK74 bake:

Current production Izzy Ak74 "true black":

M4/M16 Magpul PMAG:

Table of weights:

7.62x39 AK:

Slabside AK: 482g
Generic Stamped: 318g
Aluminum Waffle: 192g
RPK: 382g
Bakelike: 250g
Modern AK103: 202g

Non 7.62 AK:

VZ58: 184g
Colt (new) M4: 112g
AK74 Bakelite: 236g
AK74 Modern black: 196g
M4/M16 PMAG: 136g

Weights from heaviest to lightest:

2 hours ago, Sturgeon said:

 

Are they not chromed? Wild.

Correct. Finland has never had an infantry rifle with a chrome lined barrel. Even the RK95 isnt chrome lined apparently.

But Winter War on the akfiles has this to say:

”Correct, none of the Valmets or Sako Finnish AK-variants have chromelined barrels. Several reasons, first of all it was tried back in the day but we discovered that obeying western safety regulations making similar chromelining than Russians were using was just not possible. Second, after testing and shooting the RK62 it was noticed that there is no actual benefit of the chromelining, our military ammo is not corrosive or with steel bullets. (Presumably he meant bimetal jackets)
I remember reading somewhere that our military expects barrel life to be at least 20,000 rounds.”

6 hours ago, Sturgeon said:

 

I seem to remember something about Sako continuing to make barrels for the military. Also 7.62x39 chrome lined barrels last like 150,000 rounds. 

I sure hope so. And that may be well and good for the reasonable countries that chrome lined all their shit. As to why Finland didn't? I honestly don't know.

29 minutes ago, Sturgeon said:

 

From people I've talked to, the Finnish Army maintains that 7.62x39 penetrates timber better - but that isn't well supported in other testing and I think the real reason is that they're too poor to afford to switch.

 

Notably, the Finns briefly considered switching to the SCAR-L (presumably in 5.56) before realizing that would mean they'd have to deal with FN. 

Valmet got out of the firearms business in the 80s, Sako is owned by Beretta, the RK95tp has been out of production for 20+ years, and Finland has mandatory military service.

I would really, really hate to be an armorer over there. Hopefully they have a stash of barrels (Valmet never made a chrome-lined barrel and no RK62 ever had one).

I cannot overemphasize how accurate the RK62 is compared to an AKM.

That said it comes with a significant weight penalty. Also why are the Finns still using 7.62x39 when nobody else is in their entire area? I mean I know the Russians use it some but not for general issue.

What did you change/add?

1 hour ago, Oedipus Wreckx-n-Effect said:

@Alex C. I picked up a saiga in 223 for $220 back in 2007 or so. 

 

Yes Sporter configuration was odd. It worked fine enough. My barrel had a 1 in 12 twist rate. I once put a pso Russian Optic on it, 6x I believe, and noticed the 75 grain match stuff was hardly on paper. Did much better with 62 grain and under. 

 

3 inch groups are about as good as I could do. 

 

Swapping out for a tapco trigger and normal AK parts worked well. I kept the handguard, mainly because I liked how it looked and felt. 

 

Steel 12 round galil mags work without modification in a saiga. 

 

Polymer 35 round galil mags needed the shoulders trimmed, but they worked too once that was done. No bullet guide necessary. 

 

I did horrible things to mine and paid a guy to install an AR15 magwell adapter into the gun. It would lock into the gun like an AK magazine and then you could use standard AR mags. This included having to install a bullet guide into the trunnion. 

Man I remember when those rifles were $300 and everyone kind of wrote them off, but a small minority of people really did some cool stuff with them. Had I known the ban would have driven up prices so much I would have bought a damn crate!

I would put my .223 Saiga up against my Mini 14 any day. Both are very capable rifles and fun to shoot. IMO the Saiga is a great ban-state rifle.