David Moyes

Possible Turrets for Boxer

 
 
 

Possible Turrets for Boxer

 
 
 

M60 Upgrade from Roketsan

 

https://www.dote.osd.mil/Portals/97/pub/reports/FY2022/FY22DOTEAnnualReport.pdf?ver=UBO7t2O1FkRuvrB-nJDZ-g%3d%3d
 
There are a few interesting things in there, including SEP v4, APS for tanks (Trophy and Iron Fist Light Decoupled). As an aside, I recently re-posted here an article boasting of marked improvements in the Bradley-mounted IFLP, but the DOT&E 2022 annual reports claims, on the other hand, that the system continues to suffer from "effectiveness deficiencies" (page 89). Huh.
 
Interesting numbers: "The TROPHY APS adds approximately 5,000 pounds to the Abrams SEPv3. The IFLD APS adds approximately 1,780 pounds to the Bradley."
 
This is what the report has to say about the MPF (page 136) - with some relevant points highlighted:
 
 

Team Thunder partner firms visit Hanwha’s facility




 

https://www.koreaittimes.com/news/articleView.html?idxno=118825

Challenger PIP 1987





Challenger Weapons System Demonstrator 







Source: https://www.facebook.com/groups/chally

https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/defence-secretary-oral-statement-on-war-in-ukraine--2
 
Mobile Fires Programme Accelerated

AS90 replacement
Boxer RCH155, Archer on MAN and k9 Thunder potential candidates
Exploring "interim artillery capability"
 
Reviewing the number of Challenger 3 conversions

Team Thunder partner firms visit Hanwha’s facility




 

https://www.koreaittimes.com/news/articleView.html?idxno=118825

https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/defence-secretary-oral-statement-on-war-in-ukraine--2
 
Mobile Fires Programme Accelerated

AS90 replacement
Boxer RCH155, Archer on MAN and k9 Thunder potential candidates
Exploring "interim artillery capability"
 
Reviewing the number of Challenger 3 conversions

marder armor according to DE2730826C1 patent
 

 
updated 1A3, now UFP addon and roof are correct

More details have been revealed by different news outlets regarding the Puma VJTF story. According to German media, several unnamed persons involved in determining why the Puma VJTF had issues, stated that the German Army already had been warned about potential issues with the Puma VJTF as several vehicles were within "maintenance intervals" (according to earlier sources, ten were shortly before scheduled maintenance while two others had already missed scheduled). Two different teams of technicians from Rheinmetall and the German MoD's own HIL GmbH were on-site, but they were not asked to fix the vehicles. Though apparently the team from HIL GmbH was not trained on repairing the Puma VJTF, because due to lack of capacity for at the German Army's technical/engineering school (all spots were taken up by German soldiers).
 
An investigation focuses on the durability of individual high-tech parts and the cable fire in one of the Puma VJTF IFVs. In general, the lack of proper training (due to there being too few Puma IFVs in the VJTF variant, that have been shared between different units) and maintenance are considered the main culprits of the Puma's failure in the December exercise.
 
Supposedly the parts of the German Army and the government overreacted - mostly the German minister of defence, the very unpopular Christine Lambrecht. The "confidental" damage protocol (that somehow was leaked to German media) made by Rheinmetall, KMW and HIL GmbH suggests that of 76 reported errors, 44 were false alarms. A quarter of the 32 real errors already existed before the exercise and should have been fixed during maintenance beforehand. Supposedly the unit knew that not all of their Puma IFVs were fully functional when starting the exercise.
The cable fire is blamed on an error during a maintenance procedure and not a design fault. The rest of the errors has been blamed on in-proper use and described as supposedly fixable in the two lowest levels of maintenance directly by the Puma IFV's crews or assigned maintenance units during the exercise.
 
 
There is probably a bit more to the story, as it this is based on the leaked report from one side (industry & maintenance company), while the German Army likely has a bit of a different opinion. However there has been no reaction or denial of these claims from the official side.
 
___
In an unrelated statement, Esa Rautalinko (CEO of Patria) has declared that his company wants to partner with Rheinmetall and/or KMW for production of the CAVS, if it was selected by the German Army as Puma Fuchs replacement. Apparently Patria does not have the production capacity for the projected German order (they can only produce 40 vehicles per year); increasing the production capacity for the expected German order is financially less attractive for the Finish company than to cooperate with the German defence industry.
Rheinmetall is at the moment competing against the CAVS, pitching a heavily upgraded Fuchs as Fuchs replacement. GDELS also wants to win the contract, offering the Pandur EVO.

FNSS PARS III

 

Photo dump
 
Photos of the Strv Ny contenders + Leopard 2 TVM Max that participated in the competition.

 
Strv 2000 mockup + photos of the dummy 140mm round proposed for the Strv 2000

 
Strv 105

 
Initial deliveries of Leopard 2A4s, Strv 121s, to the P4 Garrison. They still retain their German Army camouflage and markings in most of the pictures.

 

I guess AJAX is off the hook?
 
 

KF51 Panther Autoloader





 
 

KF51 Panther Autoloader





 
 

There are apparrently issues with the K2PL. While the Polish MoD (MON) wants a weight below 60 metric tons, Hyundai Rotem claims that the desired protection level (supposedly frontal immunity against Russian 3BM59 and 3BM60 APFSDS rounds) cannot be achieved within that weight limit. There are also fears that the Polish elections next year might result in a shift of government and thus the possibility of a cancellation of the K2PL program.

Challenger PIP 1987





Challenger Weapons System Demonstrator 







Source: https://www.facebook.com/groups/chally

Specifications of Rheinmetall's KF41 Lynx offer for LAND 400 Phase 3.

 
 

A little summary of what went down.
Both systems met the basic requirements of protection and performance required of the program. We don't know the specific scores of both systems so it's unknown which categories each system won. The Patria AMV was a much better value than the MAV which was one of the main reasons why it was picked. As for performance, the AMV's mine protection is one of the biggest factors as well. The MAV and Type 16 both have V hull add on plates, but are not purpose built so the AMV is much better in that category. Now to the specifics. On top of the AMV being a better value, another suspected reason why it was picked was to have other companies producing vehicles. MHI is already committed to producing the Hawkei under license, the Type 89 replacement and possibly the CTWV program. Alongside that, the JSDF has been rapidly arming in the last few years and the AMV would be much quicker to production which seems to be the trend the MoD wants. The AMV contract will likely be given to another company to relieve MHI production lines and maintain other companies production lines. While not specifically a requirement, the amphibious capability of the AMV is also another thing that was alluring for the AMV. While the MAV would've been really convenient for a vehicle family, it's not all bad news for the AMV. The AMV replaces the Type 96 and the Type 82 CCV 6x6, so it reduces those systems into a single 8x8 platform which is still an improvement.
 
Contrary to what I've been seeing posted a lot, the AMV is not part of the CTWV program which is the armed ICV, RCV, and mortar system posted above. The AMV is just a new WAPC for the entirety of the JGSDF which means that Type 16 commonality isn't as important. The CTWV is only for the RDR and Recon units already using Type 16s which makes the family more valuable. So far there is no plans for any competition for that program as the platform commonality is seemingly so important there that competition wont be considered. However there was a request for companies to sign up for unmanned turret research.
There is no guarantee that this is specifically for the AMV, but there is a distinct possibility. A competition could potentially happen for the CTWV, but it's unlikely. I more see it that the JGSDF wants to have organic IFV capability inside of normal units operating the AMV and will act as an army wide IFV rather than the recon/RDR specific CTWV.
 
The AMV is a good platform, but hopefully Japan gets favorable production rights such as modification and exporting. I know with some past AMV sales, the modifications countries would make would be considered Patria intellectual property. I trust that Japan made the right choice on this one.

Tracked Boxer moving:

https://www.instagram.com/p/Cl9Sq4AtF3t/

Patria AMV XP wins competition:

https://www.patriagroup.com/newsroom/news/2022/patria-amvxp-8x8-vehicle-selected-by-japan-as-a-new-wheeled-armored-personnel-carrier-wapc-for-japan-ground-self-defense-force

"Seems that AMV scored higher in terms of basic performance and cost."
 
 

Patria AMV XP wins competition:

https://www.patriagroup.com/newsroom/news/2022/patria-amvxp-8x8-vehicle-selected-by-japan-as-a-new-wheeled-armored-personnel-carrier-wapc-for-japan-ground-self-defense-force

"Seems that AMV scored higher in terms of basic performance and cost."
 
 

Patria AMV XP wins competition:

https://www.patriagroup.com/newsroom/news/2022/patria-amvxp-8x8-vehicle-selected-by-japan-as-a-new-wheeled-armored-personnel-carrier-wapc-for-japan-ground-self-defense-force

"Seems that AMV scored higher in terms of basic performance and cost."
 
 

Patria AMV XP wins competition:

https://www.patriagroup.com/newsroom/news/2022/patria-amvxp-8x8-vehicle-selected-by-japan-as-a-new-wheeled-armored-personnel-carrier-wapc-for-japan-ground-self-defense-force

"Seems that AMV scored higher in terms of basic performance and cost."