123 Posted February 22, 2018 Report Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnsignExpendable Posted February 22, 2018 Report Share Posted February 22, 2018 12 hours ago, Khand-e said: Funny you mention it because these popped up on Akula's QQ group earlier today. Also, just for the hell of it, this thing!. Yeah, I also have that document, except in readable resolution. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_Mysterious_Stranger Posted February 22, 2018 Report Share Posted February 22, 2018 Regarding the ADVAP stuff we've discovered (open tip EPR, tungsten carbide core) this may/may not be interesting given it's mostly speculation. A round known as the Athena/Anthena PPI which came in 7.62 and .50 caliber. I don't think anyone has posted about this before, but if I am repeating known information my apologies. powerpoint document: http://www.powershow.com/view1/1f1478-ZDc1Z/NDIA_powerpoint_ppt_presentation PDFs on the rounds from small arms review: .50 caliber: https://www.smallarmsreview.com/archive/detail.arc.entry.cfm?arcid=12779 7.62mm: https://www.smallarmsreview.com/archive/detail.arc.entry.cfm?arcid=12778 There are images on the internet (especially on cartridgecollectors if you search for 'Anthena PPI') but since photobucket decided to fuck over the internet there are alot fewer to be found. Like the DU APDS stuff that is sometimes floating around and there is alot less of too. Anyhow, whilst open tip AP rounds aren't a new thing PPI rounds are a more recent version I can recall and it may have some relevance to any 'improvements' ADVAP may provide (EPR construction is similar to PPI, and I'd bet the ADVAP core is heavier than in M993.) Just my 2 cents and take it as you will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belesarius Posted February 22, 2018 Report Share Posted February 22, 2018 3 hours ago, Willy Brandt said: @Sturgeon H&K is trying the .223 PDW like FN did with their PDW SCAR. That's in .300 blackout, not .223 Says so in both the article and right on the receiver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roguetechie Posted February 22, 2018 Report Share Posted February 22, 2018 It's still ugly and it's mother dressed it funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
123 Posted February 22, 2018 Report Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 Belesarius and Sturgeon 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sturgeon Posted February 22, 2018 Report Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 minute ago, Willy Brandt said: Sorry i am still trying to ignore that stupid cartridge This is the correct way to suck up to your admin. Belesarius 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belesarius Posted February 22, 2018 Report Share Posted February 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, Willy Brandt said: Sorry i am still trying to ignore that stupid cartridge Heh. The Subsonic loading is moderately useful out of an AR type platform with a good suppressor on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
123 Posted February 22, 2018 Report Share Posted February 22, 2018 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belesarius Posted February 22, 2018 Report Share Posted February 22, 2018 2 hours ago, Willy Brandt said: Maybe but for most military applications you dont need subsonic ammo esp one that fits into existing magazines and guns, which end up blowing the gun up. Suppressors are great for the military and so on but a bigger cartridge with less speed, more recoil, less penetration, less range, less mag capacity, more weight and which can easily chamber into existing system and blow them up makes me question why you would want something like that. Maybe the SEALS will find them useful but still why do you want them? Just for clearing houses with with some poor fellas in it with no armor on? Blasting them with 2-3 5.56 rounds will do the job probably fine. But for this sole job getting a new gun in a new caliber? Colour me very sceptical. The same with 6.5mm Creedmoor or whatever they want their new sniper rifles in and that .338 Normie machine gun round. Maybe you can try to convince me but 5.56, 7.62 and .338 Lapua/.300 Win Mag seem to do the job just fine. Don't really disagree with you. I'm not the biggest fan of the Blackout, but I've seen some people who are fond of it as a replacement for the MP-5SD. So covert ops folks might find it useful. And I guess not scaring wild hogs in a semi-auto platform is useful. And I guess I approve of it as a method of finding out who's an idiot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khand-e Posted February 22, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 22, 2018 4 hours ago, Willy Brandt said: Maybe but for most military applications you dont need subsonic ammo esp one that fits into existing magazines and guns, which end up blowing the gun up. Suppressors are great for the military and so on but a bigger cartridge with less speed, more recoil, less penetration, less range, less mag capacity, more weight and which can easily chamber into existing system and blow them up makes me question why you would want something like that. Maybe the SEALS will find them useful but still why do you want them? Just for clearing houses with with some poor fellas in it with no armor on? Blasting them with 2-3 5.56 rounds will do the job probably fine. But for this sole job getting a new gun in a new caliber? Colour me very sceptical. The same with 6.5mm Creedmoor or whatever they want their new sniper rifles in and that .338 Normie machine gun round. Maybe you can try to convince me but 5.56, 7.62 and .338 Lapua/.300 Win Mag seem to do the job just fine. Well, it's pretty much agreed here that .300 Blackout is universal garbage but, 6.5mm Creedmoor and 6mm Creedmoor do legitimately beat the shit out of 7.62x51mm in most applications. SOCOM was looking to to sample 6.5mm CM and .260 rem to replace their 7.62x51mm chambered DMRs a bit ago but, haven't heard much about that lately so probably canned. =/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legiondude Posted February 23, 2018 Report Share Posted February 23, 2018 Is this the proper thread to ask for opinions of Creedmoor vs Grendel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khand-e Posted February 23, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2018 24 minutes ago, Legiondude said: Is this the proper thread to ask for opinions of Creedmoor vs Grendel? the 6.5mm Creedmoor is a significantly more powerful cartridge but won't fit in an AR-15 length mag well, while the 6.5mm Grendel will. (this also applies to action lengths in bolt action rifles of course.) The 6.5mm Creedmoor can also use longer, heavier bullets that perform better at longer ranges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sturgeon Posted February 23, 2018 Report Share Posted February 23, 2018 57 minutes ago, Legiondude said: Is this the proper thread to ask for opinions of Creedmoor vs Grendel? Sure. The Grendel is really a totally different round, far less powerful and unsuited to long range shooting due to it's low relative capacity. I would say that, today, it's niches include hunting and known distance target shooting. It also would not be a terrible machine gun round, although it doesn't conform to Modern thinking about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted February 23, 2018 Report Share Posted February 23, 2018 60 round Pufgun mag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belesarius Posted February 24, 2018 Report Share Posted February 24, 2018 PU-1 (Prototype 5.45 Mag/Belt MG) PU-21 (Prototype Belt/Mag MG) 6mm prototype DMR based off of SVD KEDR SMG (in production) Stolen from Mikhail Dragunov's FB feed. Various stuff he has worked on. D.E. Watters 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted February 26, 2018 Report Share Posted February 26, 2018 Spoiler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted February 26, 2018 Report Share Posted February 26, 2018 And of course Taking into account that this was an event near Estonian border, those guns are needed to fight underwater Estonians. Or underswamp Estonians, to be precise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted February 26, 2018 Report Share Posted February 26, 2018 PL-15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted February 26, 2018 Report Share Posted February 26, 2018 Lazarev in Tula museum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoooSeR Posted February 26, 2018 Report Share Posted February 26, 2018 moded AS "Val" Spoiler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnsignExpendable Posted February 26, 2018 Report Share Posted February 26, 2018 Steelninja333 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steelninja333 Posted February 27, 2018 Report Share Posted February 27, 2018 Something seems off.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xlucine Posted February 27, 2018 Report Share Posted February 27, 2018 At least it's not an STG-44 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khand-e Posted February 27, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2018 24 minutes ago, Xlucine said: At least it's not an STG-44 There's a difference? EnsignExpendable and LoooSeR 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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