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Sturgeon's House

Land 400 Phase 3: Australian IFV


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On 12/20/2018 at 10:49 PM, Serge said:

Yes, but the Griffin II is a low profil chassis. It’s very different. 


That’s my point. GD is offering AJAX-based variants only. They have been stressing the proven, low risk nature of their family of vehicles from the outset. Griffin (any variant) haven’t been accepted into service by any country and haven’t been subjected to a customer’s engineering & qualification processes like the AJAX families. Apart from being from the same OEM, it has no standing within the context of Land 400 Phase 3, as far as I can see. What “impact” are you suggesting?

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1 minute ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

Yep. The superstructure is rarely ever meaningful when talking about cost and ease of production, let alone risk.


For a rational customer, I’d agree. 


However, the strength of GD’s potential offering is that, with the exception of the IFV hull (arguably the simplest of the family), they are offering a fully mature, technically certified & qualified family of vehicles, as accepted by the British, from whom the majority of standards & procedures used by the Land Engineering Agency (LEA) are derived from (Def Stans & DEF(AUST)s). Deviation from already-qualified vehicles undermines this narrative, which is “Low Technical Risk/Military Off The Shelf”. 


Let’s look at some decisions that GD have made so far regarding production. 

- hulls will be manufactured as ‘green’ hulls in existing facilities (so as not to risk perceived technical maturity). 

- hulls won’t use Australian steel (so as not to risk perceived technical maturity). 


Based on the above, and that nowhere in the L400 RFT is a requirement for calibres above 30mm, Griffin 1-3, whilst interesting, and illustrative of design capabilities and future options, aren’t really relevant to the L400-3 activity. 

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  • 5 weeks later...

from IAV 2019 -
what appears to be the same model as one which was shown back in September, but this time it's yellow-ish desert-ish instead of tri-colour camo
(from this tweet https://twitter.com/gduknews/status/1087673769571831808)

(from this tweet https://twitter.com/nicholadrummond/status/1087726889618288640)

and from this article https://defense-update.com/20190121_iron-fists-aps-for-the-australian-boxers.html 


IF-LC is also included in the AJAX based tracked vehicle General Dynamics Land Systems UK (GDLS-UK) propose to the Australian Land 400 Phase 3, intended to replace the M113s in the future. A model of that vehicle was also unveiled by GDLS at the #IAVevent. Photo: Defense-Update
The AJAX proposed for Land 400 Phase III uses a manned GDLS turret that mounts an ATK 30mm cannon and a missile launcher. In addition to the two IF-LC active protection units the turret also uses dual, multi-sensor EO targeting system (note the protected, rotating commander sight) and the acoustic sensor behind it. Photo: Defense-Update


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7 hours ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

So, the Aussies want an evaluation of only the Iron Fist LC for the Boxer, because it's the only one meeting weight requirements.

This means the Phase 3 vehicle will have to use it as well.

No necessarily. Not even the 30mm gun has to be common across the phases. 

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 1/22/2019 at 9:39 AM, skylancer-3441 said:

what appears to be the same model as one which was shown back in September, but this time it's yellow-ish desert-ish instead of tri-colour camo


It is. The model shipped to Australia in September painted green, I helped out a mate by repainting it the day before the tradeshow (Land Forces) into the camouflage, after DVD in the UK, the model was repainted into the desert scheme and will (likely) appear at IDEX this week in Abu Dhabi. 

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