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Sturgeon's House

Land 400 Phase 3: Australian IFV


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32 minutes ago, DIADES said:

yes there are.  They are drivers cameras that have the FoV a driver needs.  There are no cameras on the turret, no flank cameras anywhere.  So, not Iron Vision which uses stitched together camera images to mimic seeing through the hull and turret.  The video tries to show the turret moving with the operators head movements.  But he can't see anything cos - no situational awareness cameras.  So, PR puffery.



Yes, this vehicle lacks of side and rear cameras, it really doesn't have see through armor.

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On 8/26/2020 at 5:51 PM, skylancer-3441 said:



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in this piccy, my untrained eye can see

2 set of IRON VISION sensors

2 set of IRON fist's radar

1x ELBIT commander sight

and a fore hull mounted Hanwha camera


still to come are the EOS RWS sensor packages.


why place iron vision sensor there unless intent is to use them?



and the birds eye photo add 2 more sets of IRON VISION sensor and IRON fist's radar, so 4 of each, thats 360 coverage.

+ driver''s reversing camera ;)

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20 hours ago, Kal said:

my untrained eye

Yes, Iron Fist IR and RADAR sensors are there.  Each RADAR sensor has a dedicated IR sensor.  IR is on all the time and if it sees a muzzle flash or rocket exhaust, it turns the RADAR on to detect and track a possible incoming threat.  The RADARs are off by default as they use a lot of power and give the host vehicle a RADAR cross section you could see from the moon.


Iron Fist has no sensors of use at all for human vision.  These sensors are outside the visible spectrum.  There are also a pair of LASER warning receivers.  There is no Iron Vision camera array on this turret.  If you look around the web you will see that Iron Vision fitted demonstrators have a multi-camera array.  This turret does not.  Yes, the gunners sight is present and that is the only feed available on this turret.  Utterly pointless to use a headset with it.  The sight points where the gun is pointing and vice versa.  Useless for situational awareness (no peripheral vision) and a headset is useless for aiming the weapon.  The gun is a gun, not a missile which you can point in roughly the right direction.  Don't get me wrong - I am a fan of Iron Vision and the whole concept of fused data streams, images, targeting systems etc.  But, my point is that this specific vehicle/turret does not have have the claimed capabilities.

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5 minutes ago, DIADES said:

While on the topic - latest reports in Defence Technology Review talk of 18 month delay for L400 Phase 2 integration due to lack of system maturity.


I'm not surprised, amongst other things,  Elbit in Victoria,  Rheinmetall is in Qld  and the borders are locked down hard between states due to Covid19 (and Victoria is basically 95%+ of Australia's wave 2 infections)


EOS in Canberra had their own problems https://themarketherald.com.au/electro-optic-systems-asxeos-future-plans-drastically-altered-by-covid-19-2020-04-30/


One week before formal deliveries could commence, the delivery chain was broken in multiple places due to a national lockdown and the impact of COVID-19.

A total of five essential EOS technical staff from Australia had to leave the country within 24 hours or be stranded due to airport closures and quarantine.

All accessible airports were closed to normal commercial passengers and freight. The EOS production facility, located in a secure industrial zone, was locked down by military police, along with all other defence plants.

Approximately 50 per cent of EOS local staff were forced into quarantine. The military test facility required for live firing was closed and the designated delivery points within military bases were cut off by military base closures

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1 minute ago, Kal said:

Elbit in Victoria

I think the problems are deeper and are more to do with basis system maturity in Israel.  I hear (unsubstantiated) rumors of increasing system mass, power demand and shock loads on the turret plus decreasing threat defeat capabilities...

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7 minutes ago, DIADES said:

hmmm.  Indeed.  Still that will only see forward while Iron Vision is 360 degree.  Plus the lens (if that is what they are) look too small?

yeah but there are 4 of them, you can count them in the video.


and presumably, they can use that frontal hanwha camera, its really looks like its intended for full 180 coverage so when the vehicle pokes its nose around a corner, they can see sideways before the turret is exposed.

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2 minutes ago, DIADES said:

Your pics don;t come across?  Just a random string of characters

thanks, its working on my system, but I can't tell about others, 


those pictures are links to the the screenshots that skylancer posted after that video.  Can you see those?

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3 hours ago, DIADES said:

Iron Fist has no sensors of use at all for human vision.  These sensors are outside the visible spectrum.  There are also a pair of LASER warning receivers.


This is not correct. Iron Fist uses cameras for wake-up detection and apparently they have been integrated into the Iron Vision system. See the graphic visible at #01:30 of the following marketing video:



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Australian DOD will get a good chance to test Iron vision/fist out, i don't know how much the results will be made public.  The T2000 turret is derived from Elbit, so the family DNA is high, but its still is an EOS product, and until there is an EOS RWS on it, the turret is incomplete.


(Which is to say,  we can see what they are selling, but we can't see if it matches delivery.)

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2 minutes ago, Kal said:

results will be made public

Zero.  CoA runs competitive closed tender evaluation.  That process will not be complete until late 2022 when the winner is announced.  Even after that, nothing from the trials will be public.  Once deliveries start in 2025, we may get to see info on what is being delivered.

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