United States Military Vehicle General: Guns, G*vins, and Gas Turbines

[Lord_James]

14 hours ago, Clan_Ghost_Bear said:

http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a237212.pdf

 

Reminds me a little of @LostCosmonaut‘s tank for the competition, especially with the crewman behind the gun. 

 

[Walter_Sobchak]

News story about the US gunner in that famous film footage of the Pershing/Panther duel.

 

A World War II hero returns to Germany to solve a mystery -- and meet an enemy

 

 

[Ramlaen]

[Serge]

Tank is back :

https://www.lexingtoninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/11.15.18-Tanks-Vital-to-Defense.pdf

[skylancer-3441]

from this article and comment section https://fromtheswedisharchives.wordpress.com/2018/10/16/the-american-s-tank/ 

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In 1968 a Swedish military attaché visited the ATAC in the US. Besides discussing the MBT 70 and its missile as well as new armor types they were also shown several conceptual tank designs, one of which was clearly inspired by the Strv 103

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 there are actually 13 more but not all of them are tanks, some are SPG’s some apc’s and one is arguably a helicopter.

so - I guess, that means 14 concepts, with 8 of them posted so far

....Including a couple of infantry carrying vehicles - Heavy IFV with tank-like protection, and another vehicle with remote-controlled turret (and machineguns) and protection against radiation
 

https://fromtheswedisharchives.wordpress.com/2018/11/07/us-afv-concepts-no-5/

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COMBAT VEHICLE, INFANTRY, MISSILE/ROCKET

(C) The design study was prompted by a concept proposed by an officer at the Combat Arms Group at Ft. Leavenworth about a year ago. He proposed a vehicle that combined a half infantry squad, with a turret mounted assault weapon with crew and driver. Essentially the design could be envisioned as a Sheridan lengthened to provide space for six additional men, or an MICV Concept with half the squad removed and the cupola replaced with a Sheridan turret & crew. The concept was called a Mechanized Fighting Vehicle. ATAC at that time prepared several concept versions of the proposal. The officer who proposed the idea prepared a write-up describing the merits of the vehicle and the proposed operational doctrine. The proposal sparked a great deal of lively interest in a concept of this type.

(C) This is a result of that idea. The vehicle has a low silhouette and provided 60 degree frontal protection against shaped charge and kinetic energy projectiles of current tank mounted size. Side protection is against small shaped charge warheads and KE protection up to about 30 millimeters size. The weapons are missiles and rockets in a launcher that can be elevated and controlled. The Commander’s cupola mounts a Rapid Fire Weapons System as described in previous concepts.

(C) Characteristics and Outstanding Features

a. Weight: 46 ton

b. Width: 137 inches

c. Height (top of hull): 68 inches

d. Height (overall): 100 inches

e. Length (overall): 258 inches

f. Ground pressure: 10.7 psi

g. Variable ground clearance: 6-24 inches

h.Primary armament – Missiles & Rockets

i.The vehicle provides excelent protection for the 8-man crew.

j. Previously listed advantages of this type of design are also applicable to this concept.

 

https://fromtheswedisharchives.wordpress.com/2018/11/17/us-afv-concepts-no-8-armored-infantry-carrier/

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ARMORED INFANTRY CARRIER, SPECIAL PROTECTION

Concept Description and Design Rationale

(C) This design study shows an Armored infantry Carrier with nuclear protection. The purpose of this concept was to explore the feasibility of providing an armored personnel carrier, as part of the tank-infantry team, with radio-logical shielding similar in protection to the tank is accompanies.

(C) The vehicle has a rather low silhouette and provides protection for a nine man crew. The Vehicle Rapid Fire Weapon System is remotely mounted and operated. There is also a remote controlled machine gun mounted on either side of the vehicle. Sliding hatches for entrance and exit are provided in the roof.

(C) Characteristics and Outstanding Features

a. Weight: 75,000 lbs

b. Width: 138 inches

c. Height (top of hull): 69 inches

d. Height (overall): 87 inches

e. Length: 231 inches

f. Ground pressure: 10.5 psi

g. Variable ground clearance: 6-22 inches

h. The concept provides radiological shielding in addition to conventional protection.

i. Environmental control system and air purifying device are furnished for the crew.

j. Weapons are remotely mounted and controlled.

...
and another proposal, which reminds me of Soviet (Chelyabinsk) BMPT prototypes from late 80s - same idea of providing something better than port hole for every dismount, coupled with doctrine which demands to distmount as little as possible, coupled with reducing number of dismounts to 4-5.
https://fromtheswedisharchives.wordpress.com/2018/11/19/us-afv-concepts-no-9-armored-combat-carrier/

 

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ARMORED COMBAT CARRIER

Concept Description and Design Rationale

(C) This concept study shows an Armored Combat Carrier. The purpose of this study was to investigate the feasibility of providing infantrymen with a truly fighting vehicle, rather than simply an armored carrier. In previous studies of Armored Personnel Carriers, the doctrine of the crew fighting from the vehicles has only been acknowledged by providing port holes for rifles. This permitted part of the crew to fire while on the move, while the other members remained passively inactive. The firing position, and the limited vision of the crew members makes accurate and effective fire most difficult.

(C) In this concept there are six crew members including the driver and commander. The design is based on the assumption that the major portion of the time the crew will fight from the vehicle instead of traditional dismounted role.

(C) The Commander’s cupola mounts the Vehicle Rapid Fire Weapons System with a machine gun, and provides good all around vision for the commander. There are corner mounted machine guns for each of the other crew members. This corner mounted machine gun would be enclosed and would provide excellent vision and stabilized fire for the operator. Each of the corner mounted weapons has approximately 180 degrees field of fire. The vehicle provides frontal and side protection against shaped charge warheads.

 

(C) Characteristics and Outstanding Features

a. Weight: 75,000 lbs

b. Width: 128 inches

c. Height (top of hull): 74 inches

d. Height (overall): 105 inches

e. Length: 261 inches

f. Ground pressure: 11.9 psi

g. Variable ground clearance: 6-24 inches

h. Protection against shaped charge warheads.

i. All crew members have a stabilized weapon system.

 

and another proposal - lightly armored this time
https://fromtheswedisharchives.wordpress.com/2018/11/22/us-afv-concepts-no-10-infantry-carrier-low-profile/

 

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INFANTRY CARRIER (LOW PROFILE)

Concept Description and Design Rationale

(C) This is another design study of an Armored Infantry Carrier. The purpose of this study was to explore the design feasibility of a reduced height personnel carrier that would have the minimum projected target area.

(C) The vehicle has a seven-man crew The men are seated in contoured seats, in a slightly reclining position, when the hatches are closed. In the partially open position, the crew sits upright, and the hatch provides overhead cover. The hatches flip all the way open for crew exit.

(C) In the lowered suspension mode, the vehicle armored compartment is approximately one meter in height. In the normal running position, the vehicle is approximately fifty inches high. Periscopes provide vision for the crew, and there is also an extendible panoramic periscope for better surveillance and for operating the remotely located Vehicle Rapid Fire Weapons System.

(C) The vehicle armor provides protection against rifle and machine gun fire, and against high explosive fragments. The concept can be made amphibious by inflating a peripheral curtain. There is also a remotely operating machine gun on each side of the vehicle.

(C) Characteristics and Outstanding Features

a. Weight: 24,000 lbs

b. Width: 120 inches

c. Height (top of hull) min: 1 meter

d. Height (overall) min: 47 inches

e. Length: 255 inches

f. Ground pressure: 4.0 psi

g. Variable ground clearance: 6-24 inches

h. Provides minimum projected target area against enemy threats.

i. Remotely located and controlled weapons.

 

[Clan_Ghost_Bear]

A report on using a "Mobile Energy Depot" to make and supply fuel cells to vehicles in the field:
https://digital.library.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metadc1021779/m2/1/high_res_d/4307142.pdf

[heretic88]

Stolen from otvaga2004, from Wiedzmin.

Interesting that thickness is much greater here than in older estimations.

 

[LoooSeR]

Remember Object 490B? US was there earlier than Kharkovites

 

[Andrei_bt]

 

Maybe in some conception they were, but this was not comparable level of study as 1990-1991 Morozov's project (and not 490B) http://btvt.info/2futureprojects/490_21vek.htm

 They (the US 1968 project) just made a brief essay with only basic rudimentary study.

For example the same -

 

Questionmark III.

 

[Clan_Ghost_Bear]

A few designs for the LVT(X) program. Any other info on these guys would be appreciated! 

[LoooSeR]

Driver insertion procedure

 

Spoiler

 

[Ramlaen]

Upgrades for Morocco's Abrams.

 

http://www.dsca.mil/sites/default/files/mas/morocco_18-08.pdf

[JNT11593]

https://twitter.com/SecArmy/status/1068523858708201474?s=20

[skylancer-3441]

https://m.weibo.cn/status/4314232545708008 some new pics on NGCV OMFV's MET-D, for example:

and also and another render of GCV:

this picture comes to mind:

 

 

 

 

...
Comparing that Bradley drawing with one of the original Bradley from All Vollunteer 1980-07 https://i.imgur.com/WykRCXe.jpg  (most detailed picture of soldiers in Bradley i've got so far)

Those 6 dismounts got some very generous 202-203 cm of space - that is 67,5 cm (26,5 inches) per person, for sholder or forearm-forearm breadth, which is obviously increases a lot (compared to person in summer clothes or nude) when person is carrying a lot of gear of wearing winter clothes
(which no one seems to be bothered about in 1960s or even early 1980s, so IIRC Bradley was designed with something like 56 cm/22 inches in mind - and when in 1984 they measured 95th percentile soldier in uniform for extreme cold weather ("Anthropometry of the Clothed US Army Ground Troop and Combat Vehicle Crewmen"), in turned out that he needs 62 cm/24.5 inches)

 

[Ramlaen]

[Ramlaen]

[Ramlaen]

https://www.army.mil/article/214694

 

[Ramlaen]

MEHEL 3.0 with a 10 kilowatt laser.

 

[Ramlaen]

M1A2C at Yuma.

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The list of improvements is lengthy: improved fire control electronics mean the SEPv3’s gun can shoot faster and more accurately; the engine, drivetrain, and tracks have been updated for higher performance and to support the platform’s weight increase; it may even sport hubcaps and road arms manufactured by way of 3D printing, a facet that is under test here at YPG. 

“As the technology advances, the tanks have to advance as well,” said Martin Velazquez, test officer. “The SEPv3s have a lot more onboard diagnostics than earlier iterations: they have removable screens that carry the tech manuals that can accomplish a lot of diagnostics on the vehicles without taking it to the shop.”

“A lot of people don’t realize the amount of software in this platform,” added Duda. “There are over 1.4 million lines of code on this tank.”

The newest Abrams is also more heavily armored than previous versions, which necessitates improvements in the power system and suspension

 

 

[Ramlaen]

A better version of that image, I can't tell if it's a shadow or belly armor under the crew space.

 

[Ramlaen]

[Mighty_Zuk]

US Army to buy Iron Fist APS for at least one Bradley brigade worth of vehicles, citing an 'urgent' threat (European theater).

This is an early announcement but the intentions seem very clear - They want the Iron Fist and are only held back from buying immediately as only less than half the funds were cleared ($80 mil out of $200 mil).

 

The RFI posted earlier requires an APS that was "characterized" on the Bradley and is TRL6. Only the Iron Fist meets both these requirements simultaneously.

 

RAFAEL's testing of the Trophy on the Bradley earlier this year (most likely) does not qualify as "characterization" as it's a company's independent test, but they and Leonardo DRS are likely to put up some legal fight.

 

https://breakingdefense.com/2018/12/army-bradley-brigade-will-get-israeli-anti-missile-system-iron-fist/

 

My personal take is also that the testing of additional APS systems like the RAP is either off, or indefinitely delayed, as it seems much more urgent to them to field a critical mass of vehicles with APS rather than find the absolute best solution under the MAPS program for what would be a more americanized system for the OMFV and other NGCV vehicles.

 

EDIT: Looser'd I was. By Ramlaen.

[Clan_Ghost_Bear]

The M8 and Griffin have been down-selected for the Mobile Protected Firepower bid, leaving out SAIC. The Company has stated that they plan to offer something for OMFV.

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Of course, we are disappointed that our Mobile Protected Firepower vehicle prototype was not selected,” she wrote. “As for the (Bradley replacement), we are anticipating the Army’s release of a draft RFP for OMFV with great interest. We will continue to work with our partners ST Engineering, CMI Defense, Plasan, and other technology providers to assess and evaluate the Army’s requirements

https://breakingdefense.com/2018/12/army-picks-bae-gd-for-mpf-light-tank-prototypes/

Could it be that prototype that they were building last year, or a different off-the-shelf vehicle?

[Andrei_bt]

5 M8 prototypes were made under 1992 contract.

[Ramlaen]

Griffin II