General AFV Thread

[Priory_of_Sion]

UN-white Leclercs just look off

[Alzoc]

Yes, but isn't it simply that since MBT are rarely sent in UN peacekeeping missions we are not used to see them like that and so it feel off?

 

I mean the Leopard 1 and the T-72 looks off too:

 

Spoiler

 

[Priory_of_Sion]

Yep, but at least the white kinda works with the leo in the snow 

[Mighty_Zuk]

6 hours ago, Priory_of_Sion said:

UN-white Leclercs just look off

 

IIRC one of the veteran writers in a military forum who is very familiar with this incident and those involved, said there's quite a lot of misinformation there. I'll try to investigate. 

If anyone's interested, it's supposedly about a bunch of Spike missiles left in Lebanese territory that the IDF wanted to retrieve. The French didn't know why Israeli tanks were entering the territory, but then they backed off and announced that they will not interfere with a tech retrieval mission. 

[Wiedzmin]

14 hours ago, Andrei_bt said:

 

It is nothing but an opinion, better to find some internal photos or drawings. If so it is rather "strange" design.

you can try to find some armor near the GPS and gunner prism 

[Laviduce]

2 minutes ago, Wiedzmin said:

you can try to find some armor near the GPS and gunner prism 

Tank you very much !

 

 

 

[LoooSeR]

Leo 2 in Afrin

 

Expected Urban combat, but Kurds/PYD/YPG decided that running away is superior strategy to defeat Turkey. They had number of TOW-2 and 2As, Kornets and so on.

[Ramlaen]

 

[Xoon]

General question, has there ever been AFVs or tanks built for fighting in mountainous terrain? 

[Serge]

Chinese last light tank. 

[Priory_of_Sion]

3 minutes ago, Xoon said:

General question, has there ever been AFVs or tanks built for fighting in mountainous terrain? 

Wasn't the Chinese ZTQ designed for this (I see Serge posted about it before I finished typing)? I also believe much of Japan's modern AFVs considered the country's hilly terrain in their development. Wouldn't be surprised if the Swiss Panzer 61 and 68 also took this into account 

[Mighty_Zuk]

Define mountainous. Because it is possible to say that for the last 20-30 years any Israeli AFV of the types we discuss on this forum, was built for such places. Not for the ease of transport but for protection while driving in valleys surrounded by hills that are typical for the south lebanon region.

 

Other than that, probably not much. Though I guess the US M8 (or anything that wins the MPF but we all know it's going to be the M8) will be the first candidate to go to such places if required, and Russia recently put out a series of AFVs designed for the arctic climate that may be suitable for mountainous areas because of suitability for lower oxygen density environments (or so I've heard) and the mobility requirements that are probably harsher in the arctic environment. Light weight and great off road, all terrain mobility makes arctic vehicles suitable for mountainous areas. Now here's where I may be wrong, but the Armata family was or is planned to have arctic derivatives.

[Scolopax]

I randomly recall the Romanian MLVM as a mountain-oriented vehicle.

 

[LoooSeR]

Quote

"Barys" and "Alan": new Kazakhstan armored cars.

 

 

Quote

- Recently, "Barys" has been tested at a test site in Spassk. What are the results?

- We are generally satisfied with the tests. The system is also able to fire at night, in contrast to the optical systems that are installed on previous samples. In the exercises you count the target on the principle of "hit-not hit", that is, from 10 shots it is enough to hit one shell so that you count this exercise as done. For today, for example, a low-flying helicopter target at night at a distance of 1300 meters, 6 out of 10 shells fell directly to the target. This result is very high.

https://informburo.kz/stati/barys-i-alan-novye-kazahstanskie-broneavtomobili-dlya-silovyh-struktur-fotoreportazh.html?_utl_t=fb

Photos of factory and vehicles in the link (a lot of them)

 

 

Quote

   Barys 8x8

• Crew - 2 + 1 + 8;
• Weight - 19 000 kg;
• Clearance - 450 mm;
• Wheelbase - 2 300 mm (in front), 2,550 mm (rear);
• Combat weight - 28 000 kg;
• The maximum speed is 100 km / h;
• The diameter of the turn is 22-24 m;
• Range - 800 km.

 

   Armament:

1. 57-mm remote-controlled combat unit AU-220M;
2. Remote-controlled combat module of the KAE company with a 30-mm cannon 2A42;

The engine - turbodiesel, 550 hp;
Transmission - automatic transmission
Brakes - pneumatic, disk with АBS;
Tires - 16.00 R20;
Air conditioning - 12 kW as standard with climate control system;
Electrical system - 24 V;
   Ballistic protection STANAG 4569 level 3 5.56 x 45 armor-piercing and incendiary (BBZ), 7.62 x 39 armor-piercing (BB), 7.62 x 51 (BBZ), 7.62 x 54 (BBZ), 12.7 x 9 9 NATO cartridge;
   Mine protection STANAG 4569 level 4 b Explosion protection 10 kg under the hull, 10 kg under each wheel and 50 kg from the side, at 5 m.

 

   Options:

• Winch;
• Systems of protection against nuclear, biological and chemical weapons;
• Auxiliary power supply.

 

 

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

 

Quote

   Barys 6x6

• Crew - 2 + 1 + 8;
• Weight - 17 300 kg;
• Clearance - 430 mm;
• Wheelbase - 2 300 mm (in front), 2,240 mm (rear);
• Combat weight - 22 500 kg;
• Construction - bearing body (not based on the chassis);
• The maximum speed is 110 km / h;
• The diameter of the turn is 24.5 m;
• Range - 1000 km;
• The engine - turbodiesel (336 kW, 450 hp, 1627 N / m);
• Transmission - automatic transmission;
• Brakes - pneumatic discs with ABS;
• Tires - 16.00 R20;
• Air conditioning - 12 kW with climate control system;
• Electrical system - 24V;

1. Ballistic protection of the crew compartment - (standard) B7 Stanag level 3;
2. Ballistic protection engine compartment (standard) 5.56 x 45 armor-piercing incendiary (BBZ), 7.62 x 39 piercing (BB), 7.62 x 51 piercing (BB) (except the grille), 7.62 x 54 armor-piercing incendiary (BBZ) (except radiator grille), 12.7 x 99 NATO cartridge (except the radiator grille);
3. Mine protection - protection against explosion 10kg under the hull, 10 kg under each wheel.

 

   Options:

• Tire inflation system;
• Armored inserts for the continuation of traffic with flat tires;
• Walkie-talkies, intercom;
• Additional armor - active and passive;
• The combat management system;
• Cargo winch;
• Towing rod of the NATO standard;
• Loudspeeker system;
• The system of fire-fighting equipment (engine and crew compartments, wheel arches, etc.);
• A ceiling hatch and a variety of turret/RCWS gun systems;
• Systems of protection against biological and chemical weapons;
• Tracking system for the location of the vehicle;
• Additional set of armor (for side mirrors, door hinges, windows);
• A system of cameras installed at the rear and front, connected to the display on the driver's panel and showing the corresponding rear and front view;
• Updated ballistic protection of the engine grille;
• Interior lighting - LED centralized directional light with a choice of white, green / blue and red
• Winter package to operate at temperature ranges from - 50 ° C to 50 ° C.

 

Alan is basically a SandCat

 

Spoiler

 

Quote

The main characteristics of the BKM "Alan":

• The crew is 6 + 2 + 1;
• Weight - 6700 kg;
• The weight of the combat vehicle is 8845 kg;
• Wheelbase - 3429 mm;
• Construction - frame chassis;
• The maximum speed is -160 km / h (electronically limited - 120 km / h);
• Turning radius is 6.9 meters;
• Range - 500 (plus or minus 50 at steady movement of 80 km / h);
• The engine - turbodiesel (220 kBt, 300 hp, 900 Nm at 1600 rpm);
• Transmission - automatic transmission;
• Distributing box - two-speed, electrically controlled;
• Steering gear - with hydraulic booster;
• Brakes - with ventilated discs on 4 wheels, with ABS blocking system;
• Tires - 285/70 R19,5;
• The payload is 2,000 kilograms;

1. Ballistic protection - level 3 (STANAG) 7.62 mm x 54RAPIB32 V-854 (plus or minus 20 m / s);
2. Mine protection - level 1 (STANAG) 2 hand grenades DM51.

   Options

• The ventilation system of powder gases;
• Frontal thermal camera;
• Complex of internal lighting devices;
• Rear View Camera;
• Loud-speaker device;
• Light-signaling device (LED lamps, built-in front, rear of the machine, blue and red);
• A winch with a pulling force of at least 5 tons;
• Metal grilles to protect the armored glass windshield and radiator of the power plant, in the side and rear armored windows, the front and rear lights;
• Engine preheating;
• Portholes for weapons;
• Metal protection of vital machine systems;
• Self-supporting rims to ensure the ability to continue driving after puncturing tires;
• Protection of the radiator;
• Nozzle for the exhaust system to protect against unauthorized access;
• Protective cover on the car.

 

[LoooSeR]

I guess this is Songun-915 in camo net, without ATGMs and double grenade launcher..thing.

[Xoon]

18 hours ago, Serge said:

Chinese last light tank. 

 

18 hours ago, Priory_of_Sion said:

Wasn't the Chinese ZTQ designed for this (I see Serge posted about it before I finished typing)? I also believe much of Japan's modern AFVs considered the country's hilly terrain in their development. Wouldn't be surprised if the Swiss Panzer 61 and 68 also took this into account 

I guess the Chinese ZTQ fits this.  And maybe the Type 10.  Though I can't really find anything extraordinary about the Panzer 61 or 68.

 

 

17 hours ago, Mighty_Zuk said:

Define mountainous. Because it is possible to say that for the last 20-30 years any Israeli AFV of the types we discuss on this forum, was built for such places. Not for the ease of transport but for protection while driving in valleys surrounded by hills that are typical for the south lebanon region.

 

Other than that, probably not much. Though I guess the US M8 (or anything that wins the MPF but we all know it's going to be the M8) will be the first candidate to go to such places if required, and Russia recently put out a series of AFVs designed for the arctic climate that may be suitable for mountainous areas because of suitability for lower oxygen density environments (or so I've heard) and the mobility requirements that are probably harsher in the arctic environment. Light weight and great off road, all terrain mobility makes arctic vehicles suitable for mountainous areas. Now here's where I may be wrong, but the Armata family was or is planned to have arctic derivatives.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In short, a AFV capable of traversing rocky fields at a practical speed, capable of climbing steep slopes and driving at angles. It needs to preform well in swamps, mud or snow, being able to traverse terrain common MBTs can not. It needs to be small, it has to be able to use the old infrastructure and poor roads of the mountains.  This pretty much excludes all Israeli AFVs since they tend to be large and heavy, the opposite of what you want. 

 

Being amphibious or having the ability to ford small rivers on the move is advantageous. 

 

The idea is to have the mobility to outmaneuver and ambush enemy forces which are forced to use main roads and predictable paths. 

 

13 hours ago, Scolopax said:

I randomly recall the Romanian MLVM as a mountain-oriented vehicle.

 

 

What makes it stand out? 

[Scolopax]

31 minutes ago, Xoon said:

 

What makes it stand out? 

Not sure besides the fact that its supposed to be for special mountain troops.  I can't find too much info outside of wikipedia, which itself hardly says anything on the matter.  I imagine its weight of 9 tons plays a role. The roadwheels certainly appear to be light.

 

[Priory_of_Sion]

1 hour ago, Xoon said:

 

Though I can't really find anything extraordinary about the Panzer 61 or 68.

 

 

 

They had somewhat less width than the Centurion and Leopard 1, apparently good for going through alpine tunnels. 

[Stimpy75]

[LoooSeR]

Well, i completely forgot about what North Korean tanks with all their grenade launchers and ATGMs launchers on top of their turrets reminded me until today...

 

 

 

But hey! It goes even deeper!

[That’s Suspicious]

3 hours ago, LoooSeR said:

Well, i completely forgot about what North Korean tanks with all their grenade launchers and ATGMs launchers on top of their turrets reminded me until today...

 

 

 

But hey! It goes even deeper!

 

Thats from Endwar right?

[LoooSeR]

7 minutes ago, Conner Webb said:

 

Thats from Endwar right?

Yes, T-100 "Ogre"

[Stimpy75]

[Stimpy75]

[Mighty_Zuk]

They could literally just steal the tech from the Sabra's armor and copy and paste it on the regular M60A3. But no, they just had to find a way to actually reduce the armor coverage AND make it ugly.